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Saturday, April 19, 2025 |
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sign ordinance issues? |
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John Beagle 
MUSA Official 
Joined: Apr 23 2007 Location: Middletown Status: Offline Points: 1855 |
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 Posted: Dec 02 2008 at 11:07am |
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I think the Bar B Q Junction is a perfect example of what the city ought to let us business people do with little interference from the city.
Plus the food is fantastic. |
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arwendt
MUSA Official
Joined: May 17 2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 588 |
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Posted: Dec 02 2008 at 1:09pm |
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I think the city should simply consider that any sign, no matter how shabby looking, on a living, breathing Middletown business is better than the most professional sign in the world over top of another dead and empty Middletown establishment.
As mentioned above this is "survival mode" for many Middletown businesses and not the time for this.
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“Sell not virtue to purchase wealth, nor Liberty to purchase power.” Benjamin Franklin - More at my Words of Freedom website.
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Mike_Presta
MUSA Council 
Joined: Apr 20 2008 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 3483 |
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Posted: Dec 02 2008 at 4:16pm |
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You folks are missing the point!!! "Honest Dave" was quick to pronounce signs "tacky" and legislate against them from his ivory tower seat on city council, but completely ignores the very ordinances that he helped to craft and pass.
Likewise, he ignores the rules on building permits, zoning, etc., when--as a councilman and so-called city leader--he should be setting an example of full compliance with such CITY regulations.
Then again, history shows that he always has acted as though the law only applies to OTHER people.
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Mike_Presta
MUSA Council
Joined: Apr 20 2008 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 3483 |
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Posted: Dec 02 2008 at 4:22pm |
LOL
 !!Surely you jest!! I would need to have you "taste" everything that was served to me!!!
 I would be pleased to break bread with you at any other local eatery, though, whether any of the others join us or not.
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Pacman
Prominent MUSA Citizen 
Joined: Jun 02 2007 Status: Offline Points: 2612 |
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Posted: Dec 03 2008 at 6:46am |
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Sorry John but those little signs on the side of the road everywhere would just be a mess and a nusiance. You want to put up a sign or banner on your property hey I am all for it, but to litter the roadside sorry they need to go. Just drive up Grand and down Elliott Dr. to see the mess they create. BBQ, La Raza, Check n Go and a few others, To much.
And Mike we get the Point on BBQ. Last I saw the signs were still there.
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spiderjohn
Prominent MUSA Citizen
Joined: Jul 01 2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 2749 |
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Posted: Dec 03 2008 at 7:04am |
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Hey Mike--no way I volunteer to taste YOUR food.
Maybe pacman or Mr.B will do it.
Are you still a dedicated Fricker's guy?
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arwendt
MUSA Official
Joined: May 17 2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 588 |
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Posted: Dec 03 2008 at 10:31am |
That's the problem with such an issue if you ask me. Everyone has thier own opinoin on what is a "mess" or a "nusiance". So I am not be surprised when the enforcement of such an ordance is viewed as selective at best.
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“Sell not virtue to purchase wealth, nor Liberty to purchase power.” Benjamin Franklin - More at my Words of Freedom website.
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Middletown News
Prominent MUSA Citizen
Joined: Apr 29 2008 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 1100 |
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Posted: Dec 04 2008 at 10:36am |
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I have to agree with Pacman about those tacky little yellow signs. I saw one today on my way in from work. It was no where near the BBQJ.
Mr. Schiavone, tear down those signs...
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arwendt
MUSA Official
Joined: May 17 2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 588 |
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Posted: Dec 04 2008 at 10:41am |
That's funny.
But you or Pacman or anyone else coming up with ways that limit how a business can promote itself will not create a single new job here or anywhere else, unless you want to count the pretend job of sign enforcement officer.
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“Sell not virtue to purchase wealth, nor Liberty to purchase power.” Benjamin Franklin - More at my Words of Freedom website.
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Mike_Presta
MUSA Council
Joined: Apr 20 2008 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 3483 |
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Posted: Dec 04 2008 at 11:25am |
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But Mr. Wenct...Schiavone was one of the ones who decried such signs, and helped to enact the city ordinance BANNING them!!!
I guess such signs were only "tacky" until HE decided to use them.
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John Beagle
MUSA Official
Joined: Apr 23 2007 Location: Middletown Status: Offline Points: 1855 |
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Posted: Dec 04 2008 at 1:10pm |
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Ok, you guys are right. i wasn't talking about those tacky little yellow signs, I was talking about the banner on the outdoor cafe.
Also Mike I agree, Mr. Schiavone should follow the laws and regulations of Middletown. Especially since the sign law he is violating was put in place while he was mayor! |
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arwendt
MUSA Official
Joined: May 17 2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 588 |
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Posted: Dec 04 2008 at 5:48pm |
Yeah I did not miss that. But to me it's not the important issue here. If anything, and if the little yellow signs do violate the ordinance, it's proof in my opinion that such attempts to restrict signage are a bad idea and impractical to enforce. But I have not read the ordinance nor do I know Mr. Schiavone or claim to be in any position to call him a hypocrite. So I just figured I would not go there. Like my dad told me a hundred times growing up: "son you have enough problems of your own without worrying about anyone else." It makes me laugh now but it was not funny at all at the time. |
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“Sell not virtue to purchase wealth, nor Liberty to purchase power.” Benjamin Franklin - More at my Words of Freedom website.
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Pacman
Prominent MUSA Citizen
Joined: Jun 02 2007 Status: Offline Points: 2612 |
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Posted: Dec 04 2008 at 8:04pm |
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Mr. Wendt please provide you home address so that I might have some neon orange signs made up advertising my business and place them along the right of way in front of your house. And while your at it I am sure you won't mind convincing John to allow me to hang a Nice big professional banner from his building. I mean you are for allowing a business to do whatever they want to advertise right. Maybe I'll hang one off each side of the over pass on 122. Your "do as you want business owners" advertising campaign is impractical to say the least. As I stated earlier I have no problem with any business that wants to advertise on their property, but when they start littering the areas right of way and other peoples property with signs, I draw the line. Schiavone wants to put a cold air balloon in from of his place , go for it, but the little signs running up and down the streets are an eyesore and a nuisance.
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arwendt
MUSA Official
Joined: May 17 2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 588 |
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Posted: Dec 04 2008 at 8:57pm |
Drawing countless rules that can not be enforced appears a lot more impractical to me.
So all I am saying is let's err on the side of allowing a business to advertise without undue fear of government reprisils by "sign nazis".
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“Sell not virtue to purchase wealth, nor Liberty to purchase power.” Benjamin Franklin - More at my Words of Freedom website.
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Mike_Presta
MUSA Council
Joined: Apr 20 2008 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 3483 |
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Posted: Dec 04 2008 at 9:09pm |
Spider:
I still stop at Fricker's once or twice a week for a bite to eat, and perhaps a cold beer or two.
However, it's not so much a "dedication" as it is the fact that there are very few places in Middletown where one can eat (inside rather than carry-out) after 11:00 PM. Also, at Fricker's, they keep the sounds down to a reasonable level. (The jukebox volume at most places would require hearing protection if they were industrial worksites.)
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Pacman
Prominent MUSA Citizen
Joined: Jun 02 2007 Status: Offline Points: 2612 |
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Posted: Dec 05 2008 at 6:39am |
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What enforcement Public Works drives by, pull over, pull up the sign, toss it in the back of the truck, dispose of in dumpster, repeat as needed. They sure ain't fixing the roads or guardrails, of course it is now that time of the year when we have the fountains springing up in the middle of the roadways as we had on Manchester Rd. the other morning, damn water pipes.
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arwendt
MUSA Official
Joined: May 17 2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 588 |
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Posted: Dec 05 2008 at 9:47am |
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If they want to drive around and pull up any signs let's start with the lazy bums who still have elections signs in their yard. I doubt the yellow signs will be there half as long as those things. Then of course why stop there? Let's grab that poor kid who has to dress up like the Statue of Liberry and toss him in the back of that Public Works truck too. Talk about an eye sore. An overweight Statue of Liberty standing on the corner by Frickers holding a sing and waving at cars, oh.. and smoking a cigarette - that has to be high on anyone's list of undesirable things to see.Next let's make sure we keep those Middletown hating snobs in Monroe from bringing their signs into town. I mean Riley Griffiths is one of the nicest guys you will ever meet and I wish his business the best but we can't play favorites.
And since you may remember I really can't stand gambling, I vote we ban all signs for the Fenwick Festival. Greek food never did a thing for me either so of course no signs for them in this crazy story...I could go on and on. : )
It's just a slippery slope and the roads and water pipes are much more deserving of our concern. Just my two cents.
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“Sell not virtue to purchase wealth, nor Liberty to purchase power.” Benjamin Franklin - More at my Words of Freedom website.
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John Beagle
MUSA Official
Joined: Apr 23 2007 Location: Middletown Status: Offline Points: 1855 |
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Posted: Dec 05 2008 at 10:19am |
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I agree, if you violate the law, you pay the consequence. Loss of the sign is about $5 to $10 each. A fair penalty for breaking the law.
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Pacman
Prominent MUSA Citizen
Joined: Jun 02 2007 Status: Offline Points: 2612 |
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Posted: Dec 05 2008 at 12:45pm |
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Hey I have no problem with the Kid making a buck or two. When his day is done he cleans up and goes home. The signs stay for quite a while. If old BBJ wants to have a dancing Pig out front, hey Wendt need a part time job or maybe we get one of the....no I won't go there. Hahahahaha Arwendt you crack me up today. When in the hell was the last time you saw anyone from Middletown fixing Roads, last spring and then they had a hard time doing that, had to bring in backup. Yeah lets let them just stand around and wait for a new water pipe to leak, kind of like watching grass grow. I see them driving around every day of the week no reason to not pull up the signs. As far as the others, Fenwick etc. they usually police their own signs once it is over, just as Kmart does when they have a sale.
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arwendt
MUSA Official
Joined: May 17 2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 588 |
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Posted: Dec 05 2008 at 1:56pm |
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I just drove past those K-Mart signs, and a few for some Middletown dating website and of course some Obama signs, and the BBQ Junction signs.
BUT the Cassanos Pizza I had for lunch was still pretty tasty and I hear OJ just got at least 15 years, so signs or not it's a good day.
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“Sell not virtue to purchase wealth, nor Liberty to purchase power.” Benjamin Franklin - More at my Words of Freedom website.
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Pacman
Prominent MUSA Citizen
Joined: Jun 02 2007 Status: Offline Points: 2612 |
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Posted: Dec 05 2008 at 2:33pm |
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I use to put one of those large cold air balloons in front of the Shopping Ctr at my last business every year at Xmas time. Every year I would get a Ticket on the First day, and I would ask, "how long do I have to get rid of it", he would say "10 days" and wink knowing that I had rented it for 10 days and it would be gone.
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arwendt
MUSA Official
Joined: May 17 2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 588 |
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Posted: Dec 05 2008 at 2:41pm |
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LOL |
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“Sell not virtue to purchase wealth, nor Liberty to purchase power.” Benjamin Franklin - More at my Words of Freedom website.
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spiderjohn
Prominent MUSA Citizen
Joined: Jul 01 2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 2749 |
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Posted: Dec 05 2008 at 4:49pm |
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ya know--I cover this entire city virtually every day.
I honestly don't see much of an issue with signage.
Sure, there are the small masses of temp signs lining the streets occasionally in very poor taste. however they USUALLY don't last that long, and most of the businesses using them are on shaky ground.
BBQ Junction is a quality structure, operated by quality local people.
The food quality and service has been a struggle, though the place has top notch entertainment and potential to improve. It has a crappy parking lot, in a so-so center(soon to have a vacant Aldi in front), and is located a good distance from the roadway. If they use a few impulse signs out of code in an effort to stay afloat, I don't see the issue.
The REAL issue may be the city smokescreen towards employee re-classifications and new job description creations to give pay increases through re-classifying employees and shift them to new added areas.
Still--they will have to face the music when the funds are no longer there, like every other surrounding community and governmental area.
Do you really think we have serious signage issues, especially considering the brutal business climate today?
I just don't see it.
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MadisonMom
MUSA Citizen 
Joined: Dec 09 2008 Location: MadisonTownship Status: Offline Points: 298 |
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Posted: Dec 09 2008 at 10:11pm |
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I find this thread very interesting. I own a business downtown. We also do signs. Just became a member to this site.
I guess I really don't know what's going on around downtown and the east end. Even though we are involved with a couple of committees. And we have several clients around the same area. Just keep the information coming. Someone on this topic had mentioned, lots of talk and no action, so to speak. Yeah, that's exactly what I think, especially about the downtown area. Although I do have to say the Art Central Foundation has gotten a few business/building owners to clean up so to speak. Do you realize the quantity of traffic that is on Central Avenue from Eastern Bowling Lanes to across the St Rt 122 Bridge into Madison Township? How do we get these people to stop & do business in this area? There are businesses downtown that are thriving and some that are struggling. Can't quite explain it. We, as a Middletown Downtown Business, are trying to improve and support the downtown area. For a small business we can only do so much. We need to support each other. I could go on and on but since this is my first post, I will stop now. |
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arwendt
MUSA Official
Joined: May 17 2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 588 |
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Posted: Dec 10 2008 at 11:02am |
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MadisonMom, Something that I think is important to every business these days is taking advantage of the internet to increase their marketing reach. Though I do not know what business you are in, or how well that model may apply to your situation, we would be glad to post any marketing material or press release type of information about your company here on our website. If there is anything we can do to help please give us a call or an e-mail and we will see what we can do. Thanks again, Andy Wendt |
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“Sell not virtue to purchase wealth, nor Liberty to purchase power.” Benjamin Franklin - More at my Words of Freedom website.
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