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Sunday, May 26, 2024 |
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New City Manager |
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Vivian Moon
MUSA Council Joined: May 16 2008 Location: Middletown, Ohi Status: Offline Points: 4187 |
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As of 2010
Housing Choice Vouchers..............1662 HUD Project Based.............................384 Listed as privately owned Section 202/811 Hope House............................................50 These are the only number that I have concerning this matter |
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Perplexed
MUSA Citizen Joined: Apr 22 2009 Status: Offline Points: 315 |
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Questions: How many of the 1,662 HCV units are 1) project-based and, 2) what number of vouchers are portable? Does anyone know? Moreover, does Middletown even have portable vouchers equal to the 1,008 that Mr. Adkins proposed to eliminate? Again, any answers?
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Vivian Moon
MUSA Council Joined: May 16 2008 Location: Middletown, Ohi Status: Offline Points: 4187 |
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Acclaro -The
city of No
city in the country has as much federally subsidized housing as The number of tenants living in public
housing in During the period of our study (1977 to
2002), In place of these programs, the City began its own capital program, the Ten Year Plan for Housing, which would fund the construction or rehabilitation of over 200,000 units of housing by 2002. Although the effort enjoyed an unprecedented level of municipal support, not all of the construction under the city’s Ten Year Plan for Housing [Schill et al 2002] was financed by city funds alone. Beginning in the early 1990s, much of this housing was also supported by the LIHTC. |
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over the hill
MUSA Citizen Joined: Oct 19 2012 Location: middletown Status: Offline Points: 952 |
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What I gather from these HUD vouchers is that if you want to move to Hamilton and Hamilton has an opening you can take your voucher to Hamilton and a slot opens in Middletown for some one else.Its like a big wheel with clogs in it.If you remove a clog another clog is put in its place and the wheel keeps turning around. No reduction in clogs just replacements to continue the the same number of clogs. IMO
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Vivian Moon
MUSA Council Joined: May 16 2008 Location: Middletown, Ohi Status: Offline Points: 4187 |
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The tenants vouchers are mobile now....as long as land lords in Middletown want to rent them property the City of Middletown can not force these Section 8 tenants to move out of the city limits of Middletown.
In all my years I have never seen a reduction happen. You will need to show me an example of a county that had a reduction in their Section 8 Program. |
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acclaro
Prominent MUSA Citizen Joined: Jul 01 2009 Status: Offline Points: 1878 |
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Tenant rights will be a mobile voucher, good in any locale where there is section 8 availability.
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'An appeaser is one who feeds a crocodile, hoping it will eat him last.' - Winston Churchill
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Vivian Moon
MUSA Council Joined: May 16 2008 Location: Middletown, Ohi Status: Offline Points: 4187 |
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It is my
understand that ALL 1662 voucher will be transferred to Warren and |
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acclaro
Prominent MUSA Citizen Joined: Jul 01 2009 Status: Offline Points: 1878 |
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There is no pending lawsuit.
What was filed was a PRAECIPE for DISCOVERY documents associated with Dan Tracey and Merg LLC. A request for documents will be asked associated with all internal docs that reference the his name, which will be few, and the city will have defense associated with their responsibility under HUD guidelines, to weed out, any landlords that are not complying with federal guidelines. The discovery documents, if not met with PROTECTIVE ORDER, will be a few documents associated with minor infractions which the city will claim were justified. The outcome will be the matter will be dropped in 90 days, a dismissal. processor was correct regarding the city's ability to simply reduce its voucher numbers. The contract term, long range, would extinguish the agreement, probably end of June, with no responsibility by city to renew if negotiations fail. In the event the city has vouchers moved to Hamilton, and Middletown will accept 700, Hamilton will honor that with an ordinance in place, pick up the additional processing/ administrative fees, and either the tenants move to Hamilton or an expansion of property, or remain in Middletown, but without the additional vouchers. The city of New York, with a population of 8,500,000, only has 33,000 section 8 vouchrs. That equates to less than .38 of 1%, of its total population, and less than .1% of its entire housing stock. While an egregious error made by Middletown to absorb such enormous vouchers, although they could have used NSP funds, and other federal housing grants, to build consolidated and very decent public housing, and increased the voucher number even further, which would have benefited Cincinnati State and those in section 8, by obtaining a trade or education that would stabilized their financial well being, there is nothing in federal law that states a city cannot reduce its stock after the period of contraction has expired, nor is it a form of discrimination for individuals to remain in a city in the event the vouchers are reduced. Consider this: if unemployed, and you have a job out of state, you must relocate to that state, or lose unemployment benefit. Same holds true associated with the vouchers. They will not be lost, but a holder (tenant), would be required to move to safe housing in compliance with HUD section 8, whether that be in HAMILTON, or ELSEWHERE. Stating this, that is not to agree the city had any success with its reduction efforts, over 4-5 years, other than the contract term will take care of the reduction. Many cities close waiting lists for voucher stock, because they wish to limit the amount within the community. There is no federal mandate a city must absorb vouchers to meet its population eligible for receipt. The section 8 matter will be resolved, soon, and as most have stated, in my opinion anyway, that is, admin to Hamilton. Those with vouchers either move elsewhere, or get off the voucher, or an allocation is reserved by ordinance, assuming of course, the long-term agreement is up, and that's it. I add, landlords are removed from Section 8 commonly, regardless of city, When that occurs, by federal law, depending upon the timing, and circumstance, if a foreclosure occurs as an example, the new landlord must allow the section 8 holder one year to remain in the location. Unless, the new landlord makes use of the property for prime residency, which provides the tenant 90 days to relocate. The city now will turn its attention on the unions, and particularly police negotiation and retention. I would encourage anyone who watches CNN, and Morgan Murdock's Insider documentaries, to watch his profile of Stockdale, California. You'll have a wake up call with what Middletown is headed, and soon, if it doesn't shape up, and drive revenue coming in, than pure tax and spend. When police are cut in numbers and housing stock is high, murder rates sky rocket, crime is unbearable. Put section 8 off the table, its taken care of. Turn the attention to crime and police force remaining intact, or Middletown better be recruiting the Guardian Angels along with open enrolled students. |
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'An appeaser is one who feeds a crocodile, hoping it will eat him last.' - Winston Churchill
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over the hill
MUSA Citizen Joined: Oct 19 2012 Location: middletown Status: Offline Points: 952 |
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Well TH you may have a valid question. I don't think the law suit has been dropped. The ball is in Doug and the city's court. Let's see if they have a descent volley back.
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Talking Heads
MUSA Immigrant Joined: Aug 18 2010 Status: Offline Points: 27 |
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How can Mr. Adkins be hired as the city manager when he is personally named in a pending lawsuit along with the City of Middletown? Has this lawsuit been dropped? If not, then it seems Mr. Adkins should have been disqualified from candidacy until and if the matter is resolved. Is this another sham - hire Mr. Adkins to "coverup" the past potential fraud, deception, and misappropriation of funding?
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Stanky
MUSA Resident Joined: Jul 04 2011 Status: Offline Points: 193 |
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Vivian, why is it discrimination to ask (free) renters to move? If someone will buy my house, I'll gladly move!
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acclaro
Prominent MUSA Citizen Joined: Jul 01 2009 Status: Offline Points: 1878 |
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Thank you Perplexed.
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'An appeaser is one who feeds a crocodile, hoping it will eat him last.' - Winston Churchill
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Perplexed
MUSA Citizen Joined: Apr 22 2009 Status: Offline Points: 315 |
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I heard that Nelson Associates, current contractual manager of the HCV Program for Middletown, will be closing their office on June 1. If so, all of the comments about BMHA and Warren County taking over the 1662 vouchers is true.
By the way, how many of the 1662 units are project-based? And, how many are not? Those vouchers not project-based are transportable. The tenant may take these out of Middletown, assuming that the new rental unit meets HUD Housing Quality Standards and that the landlord is amenable to having a lower-income renter. As of 2008, thanks to information provided by CONSOC, there were a few HCV tenants who lived out-of-state. This landlord information was shared with Les Landen, Marty Kohler, Judy Gilleland plus the Police Department. I hope that this helps. And, as Bill O'Reilly might say, "Middletown has entered the worst phase of the Danger Zone." |
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acclaro
Prominent MUSA Citizen Joined: Jul 01 2009 Status: Offline Points: 1878 |
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Thank you. Perhaps the term is ending, and all will be transferred to Hamilton.
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'An appeaser is one who feeds a crocodile, hoping it will eat him last.' - Winston Churchill
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Vivian Moon
MUSA Council Joined: May 16 2008 Location: Middletown, Ohi Status: Offline Points: 4187 |
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We talked about Middletown, based on population only being required to carry around 700 vouchers. If this is the law of the land, why is Middletown still required to carry 1662,
I don't know where this 700 number came from...or that being the law of the land? I need for you to understand...reducing vouchers is like un-ringing a bell...and as difficult. You can not displace 1,000 families + kiddies because City Hall made a mistake in 2000. That is discrimination. The only thing that is going to make this better now is JOBS |
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Perplexed
MUSA Citizen Joined: Apr 22 2009 Status: Offline Points: 315 |
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Acclaro -
Ohio recipients of HCV funds are statutorily required to file a multi-year Consolidated Plan with the HUD Cleveland Area Office. If memory serves me correctly, said Consolidated Plan covers either a three- or five-year period. The HCV Annual Action Plan that I noted in prior posts, is required to be submitted to the HUD Cleveland Area Office for each individual year of a multi-year Consolidated Plan. I don't know which year the city is currently operating under. And, if I recall, didn't HUD deny approval of a new Annual Plan or Consolidated Plan in the past few years? The best answer to this is to contact HUD Cleveland Area Office legal counsel or senior administrative staff. |
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VietVet
MUSA Council Joined: May 15 2008 Status: Offline Points: 7008 |
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We talked way back when about the number of vouchers given to a community being based on population. If Middletown's population is declining, shouldn't the number of vouchers be also? We talked about Middletown, based on population only being required to carry around 700 vouchers. If this is the law of the land, why is Middletown still required to carry 1662, more than twice the amount it is suppose to have? "Because they ask for more at one time" shouldn't be the answer on a on-going basis. The city should be able to dump the 1662 (less the required 700) back to HUD at some given time,shouldn't they? Experts? |
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I'm so proud of my hometown and what it has become. Recall 'em all. Let's start over.
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acclaro
Prominent MUSA Citizen Joined: Jul 01 2009 Status: Offline Points: 1878 |
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processor, I don't disagree with your position, and indeed, share it, that it was unwise to elevate Section 8 vouchers. I also completely agree that by having the highest percent in Ohio doesn't create a healthy brand image.
Tenants under federal law, and for that matter, state, have rights. Undoubtedly, HUD would have concerns associated with individuals (tenants), and would assume, without contract review, there to be a provision which would allow for some degree of transitional time for any decrease. If all cities decided at once, at end of year term, to abolish their vouchers, chaos would be expected. I suspect the feds factored that in their calculus. I would also expect there to be an addendum for some aspect of automatic renewal, unless there to be fraud, misappropriation of funds, neglect, et al. I have not read any contract with a tenant nor landlord, but suspect, there would be a class action suit brought by the landlords if the funds went away, whether they prevailed or not. I recall Mr. Picard stating it would be a costly battle. As this problem has been known for some period of time, why is the remedy of extinguishing a one year contract only coming forth now, and not 3-4 years ago? I understood the city was offering residents in the program an opportunity to move to another area, and make use of the voucher, which had little impact. If Hamilton receives the vouchers and opens property, it would seem the problem corrects itself. |
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'An appeaser is one who feeds a crocodile, hoping it will eat him last.' - Winston Churchill
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Vivian Moon
MUSA Council Joined: May 16 2008 Location: Middletown, Ohi Status: Offline Points: 4187 |
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I don't understand on what basis a landlord could sue the
city if the number of vouchers are reduced. |
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processor
MUSA Resident Joined: May 07 2013 Status: Offline Points: 151 |
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Acclaro,
Most contracts have end dates and/or out clauses. Just because there is a contract doesn't mean that there is no way out of it. Also, if the contract doesn't stipulate the number of vouchers HUD may have little recourse if the city chooses to reduce the number of vouchers. I don't understand on what basis a landlord could sue the city if the number of vouchers are reduced. The city doesn't have contracts with individual landlords. The huge number of vouchers certainly did not, by themselves, cause Middletown's problems, however they are not helping turn the city around. The city is turning into one big housing project with all of their typical ills and is further eroding Middletown's image and chance of turning around. It's our money going to support the additional police service required not to mention the costly issues this causes the school system. |
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acclaro
Prominent MUSA Citizen Joined: Jul 01 2009 Status: Offline Points: 1878 |
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Perplexed; I am not a landlord in any means associated with HUD housing or property rentals of any sort.
How long would it take to extinguish a contractually bound agreement between HUD and the city of Middletown....one year, July of this year, assuming that is fiscal, 2, 3, 5 years? Simply curious. And, in your professional opinion, would HUD be willing to reduce them? If the vouchers were distributed to Butler to administrate, would an ordinance barring a number in Middletown, put the vouchers back into county hands to be spread against areas outside Middletown? Thanks your your reply....curious only from my end. |
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'An appeaser is one who feeds a crocodile, hoping it will eat him last.' - Winston Churchill
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Perplexed
MUSA Citizen Joined: Apr 22 2009 Status: Offline Points: 315 |
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Acclaro, you are correct about the lack of emphasis on Economic Development over the past 15 years (or longer).
The planners and bureaucrats have brought Middletown: the downtown mall, the Maple Pork (Park) housing subdivision, extravagant NSP housing activities, the de-emphasis of housing rehabilitation, the de-emphasis of the First-Time Buyer Downpayment/Closing Cost Assistance Program, Lake Middletucky, extravagant expenditures of limited funds for downtown demolitions and other real estate deals, the loss of thousands of dollars on foreclosed HUD homes conveyed to the city, the scrapping of 2007-08 efforts to meaningfully involve local realtors and mortgage bankers in HUD-assisted homeownership endeavors, etc. etc. Once again, take a drive through Ward 2 neighborhoods to observe the devastation of the wrecking ball. Also, please note that hundreds of thousands of housing revolving loan funds were emptied to provide for the Ohio Moving Forward blitzkrieg. The future is bleak. It's time for Forbes Magazine to do an update on the conditions in Middletown. |
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Perplexed
MUSA Citizen Joined: Apr 22 2009 Status: Offline Points: 315 |
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Every 12 months the City of Middletown is statutorily required to file a Housing Choice Voucher (HCV) Annual Action Plan with the Cleveland Area Office of HUD. Upon agreement of "The Plan" by HUD, a HCV grant agreement is signed by HUD and the City of Middletown.
I am certain that Doug Adkins has originals or copies of these documents. During my employment with the city, these records were solely in the possession of Marty Kohler. The City Manager or City Clerk may also have copies of same. |
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acclaro
Prominent MUSA Citizen Joined: Jul 01 2009 Status: Offline Points: 1878 |
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processor; I know contract law very well. I didn't have the time to go into the weeds on HUD federal title sections, nor intend to.
As there are two parties to the agreement, it is clear HUD would not agree to reduce the vouchers to a number less than current, which will render the ordinance moot. For the city, it would therefore be: accept what you have, or you have nothing, including other federal grant support. My opinion of course. I would also believe landlords would assert compensatory claims against the city and tort, for violations associated with public policy. And, the damage to Middletown's reputation is soiled further. Vouchers did not ruin Middletown processor, the lack of economic development has. If the city wants zero vouchers, go for it. |
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'An appeaser is one who feeds a crocodile, hoping it will eat him last.' - Winston Churchill
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processor
MUSA Resident Joined: May 07 2013 Status: Offline Points: 151 |
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Ms. Moon,
Just saw your post. If the city were to forsake the money used to administer the program and pass an ordinance to limit the number of vouchers in the city limits, what recourse would HUD have especially since their agreement is only an annual one? |
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