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A.J. Smith |
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Mike_Presta
MUSA Council Joined: Apr 20 2008 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 3483 |
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In my humble opinion: As meager as the pay may be, each council member is paid (approximately $208 per meeting) for the time they spend attending city council meetings. If any council member uses that time to perform the duties of another paid position, it would be illegal. It certainly appears that AJ has used his paid time during Council Comments, and during debate on some issues, to perform what could be construed as his duties as a paid employee and a regional field director of We Are Ohio. If these are the facts, then it is no different then a City employee who might be, say, preparing tax returns for pay during working hours.
Well, it is a little different because We are Ohio is trying to make SB 5 a ballot issue, so it could also be construed as illegal electioneering. |
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“Mulligan said he ... doesn’t believe they necessarily make the return on investment necessary to keep funding them.” …The Middletown Journal, January 30, 2012
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VietVet
MUSA Council Joined: May 15 2008 Status: Offline Points: 7008 |
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NOOOOOO, the playing field has NEVER been level Tony. You have not been paying attention to the comparisons between a union shop and a non-union shop and what the public world offers the employee and what the private world offers. PUBLIC WORLD A right to collective bargaining-ie. discussion with the employer as to raises with a signed contract PRIVATE WORLD No collective bargaining rights-take what they offer, no contract unless top level manager or CEO PUBLIC WORLD Pay approx. 9% toward the premiums for health, dental bennies PRIVATE WORLD Pay anywhere from 15% to 24% out of your paycheck for benefit premiums PUBLIC WORLD Currently have step increases BETWEEN regular raises coupled with the regular negotiated raises per year PRIVATE WORLD NO step increases available, no negotiated raises available PUBLIC WORLD Automatic contract negotiated raises for years to come BEFORE BEING EVALUATED/BEFORE WORK IS DONE no matter what kind of job they do. PRIVATE WORLD Year by year merit evaluation done by the contributions from the last year and already accomplished. Raise based on value to the company FOR THAT YEAR, not a predetermined unproven amount each year for many years. PUBLIC WORLD Retirement paid for by public without contributions from employee PRIVATE WORLD Retirement paid for by company with employee contributions in the amount of 5-10-15% deductions from employee paycheck PUBLIC WORLD Sick time paid upon leaving the employment of said public employer PRIVATE WORLD Sick time lost when you leave the company. No pay for accumulated sick time. Some employers don't even offer sick time hour accumulation. PUBLIC WORLD (using the example from the recent school district early retirement package offered to the teachers) A cool $45,000 to leave plus all the sick time pay accumulated PRIVATE WORLD (if you are downsized) A lump sum payment equal to a thousand bucks for every year you were there. (As in at P&G when I was downsized. SB5 is just bringing the Public sector back in line with what the private sector has been receiving for many years.....and the public workers don't like their little world brought back to reality and they will not accept the fact that many cities can no longer afford to pay what the unions are asking for. Over the years, the unions have negotiated themselves out of reach of what the city employer can afford. "City council only approves negotiated deals and recommends the parameters of the deal; they do not negotiate the deals themselves" Then if they approve the negotiated deals (your words), they do have a sayso in the negotiations by being the final judge as to whether they will happen or not. Your statement tells me they can put the stop to the agreed upon contract and make the city leaders and the union go back to the neg. table to restart talks. This doesn't look like the Public and Private sectors are on a level playing field to me. |
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Bocephus
MUSA Citizen Joined: Jun 04 2009 Status: Offline Points: 838 |
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Are these people idiots for paying aj to be in charge of something? He couldn't wipe his arse with both hands and mirror.Just shows you how politicians thrive on ignorance to push thier agendas.
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TonyB
MUSA Citizen Joined: Jan 12 2011 Location: Middletown, OH Status: Offline Points: 631 |
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Vet - Only one question: Who agreed to all of those things you list? No one forced this situation upon anyone. Not to mention that you compare a union situation in the public sector to a non-union situation in the private sector. Kind of an "apple - orange" comparison.
Bocephus - I agree with your assessment concerning how politicians thrive on ignorance to push their agenda. The other part of that is disinformation and partial information plus the demagogery of their opponents. I'm very tired of voting for the least worst of two options; I want to vote for the BEST option. For someone as irrelevant as AJ Smith, there seems to be a lot of time and energy devoted to discussing him. Those of you who are supporters of SB5 seem to actually think that Mr. Smith is somehow a threat to this law staying a law. Are you really so sure that this issue will make it to the ballot? Or are you worried that the voting public will strike down this law? acclaro - are you saying it would be alright for AJ to vote on contracts where there are increases but not where there are cuts? Does AJ's vote on the recent contracts render them null and void? IMO, this is a case where even the appearance of conflict of interest constitutes a problem. I already stated my opinion regarding what Mr. Smith should do and I'll leave it at that. I've yet to hear anyone comment on Mr. Becker's statement concerning violations of the law by the city. Isn't malfeasance a serious issue? Or is it because Mr. Becker supports SB5 that he gets a free pass?
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acclaro
Prominent MUSA Citizen Joined: Jul 01 2009 Status: Offline Points: 1878 |
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Tony, I am beginnning to pull my hair out. ASS would not vote on any issues related to unions which also are an outcome of SR5, its called a "conflict of interest". He is paid to be an advocate of SR5, hence, could not vote. Lets use another anlogy. If Mr. Becker bought a $300,000 Emergency Response System tower and Middletown wanted to pay Warren Cty $50,000 a year to also use it, Mr. Becker could not VOTE on council's decision because of the perceived vested interest in a decision linked to him as an individual and the county he is employed. If Brown Mackie wanted to move in one of buildings bought for Cinci State, ASJ could not vote to allow that to happen, she woud recuse herself. Making this issue far more complicated than it is. The debate is about improprietries, not what Smoith is doing or not doing. I said it doesn't bother me he choses to be paid to lobby for its defeat, but by doing so, it runs in contradiction to his council responsibilities.
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VietVet
MUSA Council Joined: May 15 2008 Status: Offline Points: 7008 |
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TonyB states "Vet - Only one question: Who agreed to all of those things you list? No one forced this situation upon anyone. Not to mention that you compare a union situation in the public sector to a non-union situation in the private sector. Kind of an "apple - orange" comparison"
TonyB......Who agreed to all of those things you listed????? The people who agreed to those terms when they decided to take the jobs in the respective areas, be it private or public sector. You are correct, no one forced anyone to take these jobs but ya gotta work somewhere to live, don't you? The only ones that would be forced to take a job are the ones that are unemployed, have been looking for awhile, need the money to pay the bills and keep a roof over their heads and have obligations. Pretty much have to take anything that comes along if you are in a desperate situation. That is, until the job market opens up. How in the world do you get that union/non-union/ public/private sector is an apples to oranges comparison????? The basics of each are already there and are not that different. It is the bennies, wages, the difference in the amount taken out of the paycheck for each, the pay for sick time accrued versus getting nothing by leaving in the private sector, the merit way of evaluation in the private sector versus the "contract for 3 years at a time" union wages for work not done yet that are the real differences. It is also a fact that private companies can afford to pay their workers wages and benny costs with the help of the employee sharing the premium costs (if they can't, they downsize and consolidate operations eliminating duplication of jobs. The cities, with their union employees, are finding out that they can no longer meet the demands of their union workers. I don't see the respective job duties as being apples to oranges. Tony also states.... For someone as irrelevant as AJ Smith, there seems to be a lot of time and energy devoted to discussing him. Those of you who are supporters of SB5 seem to actually think that Mr. Smith is somehow a threat to this law staying a law. Nope. I don't think anyone cares what Smith does to get SB5 repealed. The discussion concerning Smith has centered around the perceived conflict of interest involving Smith's activities with the special interest repeal group, and him drawing a paycheck as a field DIErector and his role as a councilperson and his obligations to the city. These two areas may be in conflict with each other as the repeal group, if successful, may place the city in a bind regarding negotiations and with limited funds to apply to union demands. JMO |
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TonyB
MUSA Citizen Joined: Jan 12 2011 Location: Middletown, OH Status: Offline Points: 631 |
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Vet - I happen to agree with that. I , also do not think that Mr. Smith should be working for a PAC (as in political action committee) and holding elective office because of the perception created. I believe I wrote up there He should either give the money back or resign and pursue this job. This council and this city simply can't afford the expense of lawsuits and the distraction from key budgetary and service decisions. We've already had one council member declare in open session that this city violates the law and has done so for years. What kind of declaration does that admission say about past actions?
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Bocephus
MUSA Citizen Joined: Jun 04 2009 Status: Offline Points: 838 |
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The only way aj will leave is if he is forced out,he actualy feels everything he is doing or has done is justified,after all he follows obamas teachings and look how that is going right now.
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TonyB
MUSA Citizen Joined: Jan 12 2011 Location: Middletown, OH Status: Offline Points: 631 |
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Hey Bocephus, who got bin Laden?
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Paul Nagy
MUSA Citizen Joined: Jan 11 2009 Status: Offline Points: 384 |
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Leon Peneta and the Navy Seals. pn
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TonyB
MUSA Citizen Joined: Jan 12 2011 Location: Middletown, OH Status: Offline Points: 631 |
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Mr. Nagy, who gave the order?
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Bobbie
MUSA Citizen Joined: Jun 05 2009 Location: Middletown Status: Offline Points: 288 |
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Tony - he was taken down while Obama was in office - he deserves credit for that. However I can think of about 3000 families that would have had no issue giving that same order.
Had he let him walk away it would have been the biggest political disaster of his career. Even more then the 4 gasoline, huge deficit, high unemployment rates to name a few.
Credit goes to the Navy Seals and all the other service members.
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TonyB
MUSA Citizen Joined: Jan 12 2011 Location: Middletown, OH Status: Offline Points: 631 |
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Bobbie - thanks for the post. Obama actually deserves credit for following thru on his declared campaign promise to make the killing of bin Laden and the defeat of al-Qaeda in Pakistan and Afghanistan. He is the one who made it a top priority instead of the previous administration who decided that Iraq was the greater threat.
Credit always goes to those who serve. It also demonstrates to the world that we will not allow such attacks to go unpunished. The $4 gasoline, the huge defits and the high unemployment was caused by the previous administration cut taxes and the started two wars without pay for them. Where are those jobs that were promised by these tax cuts to the wealthy, the so-called "job creators"? Corporate profits are at an all-time high yet the jobless rate continues to climb. There can be no demand for products if people have no money in their pockets. We need to rebuild our national infrastructure including our electric transmission grid and national transportation system. We need the equivalent of a "Marshall Plan" for America!!!
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Bocephus
MUSA Citizen Joined: Jun 04 2009 Status: Offline Points: 838 |
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Navy Seals
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Bocephus
MUSA Citizen Joined: Jun 04 2009 Status: Offline Points: 838 |
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Just blame it on corrupt politicians and greedy people of both parties.Its just getting old hearing how gwb messed up the Country and for the record I never voted for Bush either election and I can promise I did not or will not in the future vote for Obama.Although I can agree with some things he says I think he like all the Politicians of recent history put themselves and thier Political parties before the interests of the people they are suposed to represent. |
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Bocephus
MUSA Citizen Joined: Jun 04 2009 Status: Offline Points: 838 |
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Hey Tony who do you wanna give the credit to for leaving behind a rare and top secret Helicopter for our good comrades the Chinese to clone and use against us in the future? I hear thier are already chinese on the ground in Pakistan looking at the wreckage.
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Bocephus
MUSA Citizen Joined: Jun 04 2009 Status: Offline Points: 838 |
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President Obama Holds on to Bush-era Intelligence and Military Chiefsby Kimberly Schwandt | May 12, 2011 Even though he objected many of the practices and missions they executed, President Obama has shown confidence in many of the Bush-era military and intelligence leaders, and looked for ways to keep them in his administration. The latest is FBI Director Robert Mueller, who the president would like to stay on another two years. Thursday Obama announced he was seeking Congressional approval to keep Mueller, who has led the FBI since just before 9/11, in place. "In his ten years at the FBI, Bob Mueller has set the gold standard for leading the Bureau. Given the ongoing threats facing the United States, as well as the leadership transitions at other agencies like the Defense Department and Central Intelligence Agency, I believe continuity and stability at the FBI is critical at this time," Obama said in a statement. The president also asked for Defense Secretary Robert Gates to stay at the Pentagon when Obama first came into office. Gates was one of two Republicans in the president's cabinet. The secretary was former President George W. Bush's pick to lead the military after Donald Rumsfeld left at the peak of chaos in Iraq. Another military chief who Obama has leaned on is General David Petraeus. Petraeus led the Iraq troop surge and was credited with helping turn the war around for the Bush administration. Obama was against this strategy at first, but has since acknowledge its success. Petraeus was appointed by Obama to serve in several capacities including taking over as the top commander in Afghanistan after General Stanley McChrystal resigned amid a damaging interview. Obama has now nominated Petraeus to lead the CIA. Many of the missions these men oversaw - enhanced interrogations, Guantanamo Bay, the Iraq War and surge, the mission in Afghanistan -- Obama was critical of on the campaign trail and even while president. It's not uncommon in times of war for presidents to look for stability and avoid making sweeping changes, but it's ironic he's been so vocal about many of the policies these leaders took part in. "Remember we have a change at CIA, we have a change at the Defense department, this willingness of director Mueller to continue to serve for 2 more years help provide continuity which is important," White House Press Secretary Jay Carney also noted Thursday. Some Republicans have argued that the killing of Usama bin Laden was able to happen under Obama's watch because of Bush-era policies. Obama has argued that in the past resources were diverted with missions like the war in Iraq from focusing and being able to capture bin Laden. Sen. John McCain, R-Ariz on Tuesday said that he didn't think enhanced interrogations like water boarding led to getting bin Laden. McCain, who was also a prisoner of war in North Vietnam for several years, was responding to assertions made by former Attorney General Michael Mukasey. When asked last week if the White House could say with certainty that bin Laden's hideout wouldn't have been found without enhanced interrogation, Carney said that there wasn't one item or technique that tipped them off and multiple avenues were used. "I can say with certainty that no single piece of information, with the exception of the address of the compound, was vital to this -- was singularly vital to this -- because we're talking about tiny bits of information that were compiled by unbelievably competent professionals over nine and a half years," Carney said. House Judiciary Committee Chairman Lamar Smith, R-Texas, says that Mueller was very deep into the intelligence about bin Laden and other potential terror threats. He says that the killing of bin Laden and subsequent intelligence dump was one of the reasons why the administration kept Mueller on board. Congress will have to write legislation for Mueller to stay on longer than the appointed ten-year tem. They'll have write that legislation soon and pass it in late May or early June. Fox News' Anne McGinn and Chad Pergram contributed to this report. Read more: http://politics.blogs.foxnews.com/2011/05/12/president-obama-holds-bush-era-intelligence-and-military-chiefs#ixzz1MBgUP2Ua |
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acclaro
Prominent MUSA Citizen Joined: Jul 01 2009 Status: Offline Points: 1878 |
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Gutsy decision Tony? That's rather disingenuous by Obama. Ollie North had a great point recently. Barack had three choies: 1) Do nothing 2) Bomb the hell out of the building turning it to rumble, but would gain no evidence as to whom was inside the building and worry about killing Pakistani soldiers within 100 yards at their West Point equivalent (which no one would do---alienate Pakistan by bombing West Point equivalent, sure, wise decision, and not an option 3) Let the CIA and the special forces through Team 6 do what they did.
If he hadn't blundered in Lybia, he would have cowarded and taken option 1, mark my words. Hardly a tough choice, and made for political purposes. He would have preferred doing it next year a few months before the elction, but with gas so high and his gross mismanagement of Lybia, he chose door 3, and only for political purposes.
Are you AJS under the heading of Tony?
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Paul Nagy
MUSA Citizen Joined: Jan 11 2009 Status: Offline Points: 384 |
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pn
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Mike_Presta
MUSA Council Joined: Apr 20 2008 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 3483 |
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No! He just thinks he's God!!!
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“Mulligan said he ... doesn’t believe they necessarily make the return on investment necessary to keep funding them.” …The Middletown Journal, January 30, 2012
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TonyB
MUSA Citizen Joined: Jan 12 2011 Location: Middletown, OH Status: Offline Points: 631 |
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acclaro - is there no insult you will not stoop? The idea that I am somehow speaking as or for AJS is troubling to me on a number of levels. First of all, I am not AJS apologist or defender. If I disagree with him, I will say so and furthermore, I will tell him as well. Mr Smith will testify to that fact. Second, the ideas that I have expressed are mine and mine alone. I speak for no one other than myself and I do not claim to represent the views of anyone other than myself. Third, I take personal responsibility for what I say and do and for what I have said and done. I do not hide behind anyone. If I express a belief or opinion, it is because it is mine. If I agree with someone else's belief or opinion, I will say so. If I disagree, I will say so and attempt to explain why without resorting to insults or derogatory commentary. The implication that I am somehow someone else or would pretend to be so is deeply offensive!
Mr. Nagy, Mr. Presta, Bocephus, The point is, bin Laden is dead. Obama was president and gave the order to do so. Many people deserve credit. I find it amusing that the one person who you cannot even bring yourself to admit deserves any credit for this is Obama!!! Is it so difficult to support the president of the United States on such an important national issue or is it just that you can't bring yourself to accept Obama as president?
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TonyB
MUSA Citizen Joined: Jan 12 2011 Location: Middletown, OH Status: Offline Points: 631 |
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Bocephus - I completely agree with your assessment about both parties being responsible. Here's the kicker for you, I voted for both Bush and Obama!!! The only two presidents I did not vote for were Carter and Clinton. How's that for coming clean on political affiliation!!! That's why I say, whether (D) or (R), do not vote for either of these parties. This two party gridlock must be removed from our political system. The very idea that elected officials serve the people who elected them has been distorted by both of these political parties and they need to be removed!!! What part of VOTE THEM OUT!!! have I failed to articulate in my previous 270 posts here.
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Bocephus
MUSA Citizen Joined: Jun 04 2009 Status: Offline Points: 838 |
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Mr. Nagy, Mr. Presta, Bocephus, The point is, bin Laden is dead. Obama was president and gave the order to do so. Many people deserve credit. I find it amusing that the one person who you cannot even bring yourself to admit deserves any credit for this is Obama!!! Is it so difficult to support the president of the United States on such an important national issue or is it just that you can't bring yourself to accept Obama as president? Do I sense a"Racist" accusation?
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TonyB
MUSA Citizen Joined: Jan 12 2011 Location: Middletown, OH Status: Offline Points: 631 |
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Bocephus - I don't know, I didn't say anything about the why's or wherefore's behind accepting that Obama is president. Many people don't think Bush 43 was legitimate in the 2000 election. What your reasons are or are not are for you to decide, not me. Any sense of accusation is of your creation.
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Mike_Presta
MUSA Council Joined: Apr 20 2008 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 3483 |
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And you included me in this group for what reason??? I neither gave nor denied "credit" to anyone for ordering the offing.
Here's a hint: When you see the "chuckling" emoticon following one of my comments, it definately means that I am trying to make a joke. THAT is what you should have "found amusing." Obviously I don't always succeed, but it means I am trying!!!
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“Mulligan said he ... doesn’t believe they necessarily make the return on investment necessary to keep funding them.” …The Middletown Journal, January 30, 2012
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