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Encouraged To Attend!

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randy View Drop Down
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    Posted: Aug 16 2010 at 12:32pm

There has been a lot of talk about the downtown area being turned into an art district….A LOT!! Not just here on MUSA, but on the Middletown Journal story comments as well.  

 
My question is….will anyone show up tomorrow to oppose this vote or at least express there feelings about the issue? I have read comment after comment about the how this venture is the wrong thing for our city leaders to be doing to bring life to a downtown that has seen its prime come and go.
 
I know the views of most MUSA members, and I agree with you. I am all for an art center, but I am not ok footing the bill for such a thing. This is something I would never visit and would get no use out of. But that is just me.

 

What I want to see happen is for people to show up and fill out a comment card and tell our leaders to VOTE NO or VOTE YES if that is what you want to see them do. The point is to show up and tell them, look them in the eye and let them hear your voice. If they listen is another story, but no one can ever say that MUSA members weren’t there to voice their concerns.

 

So PLEASE I am calling on the Vet, Presta’s, spider John’ s, Bill, Hermes, Kelly, Wasteful, SW Ohio, Moon’s, Self’s, Mariann, 409,Jag123, all the members of this forum show up tomorrow speak your mind!!!

 

I ENCOURAGE YOU TO ATTEND!!!!

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randy View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote randy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug 17 2010 at 6:30am
I guess the lack of responses means, just what I thought....no one will show!!!
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VietVet View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote VietVet Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug 17 2010 at 7:14am
Randy- if I can get my son or his wife to take care of my wife, I'll try to be there.

With Mike P's permission, of course, someone should make a copy of Mike's 8:53am post from yesterday and read it to council. Pretty much spells out and provides a good overview of all of our responses concerning this issue, doesn't it?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mike_Presta Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug 17 2010 at 7:19am
I already said that I'd be there.
“Mulligan said he ... doesn’t believe they necessarily make the return on investment necessary to keep funding them.” …The Middletown Journal, January 30, 2012
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote spiderjohn Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug 17 2010 at 7:46am
good luck!
I have been pummelled down there enough, and can already envision how this black comedy(actually a poorly-scripted Shakespearean tragedy) will play out.
 
Funny how important and topical we were when we were supporting the new faces to bring change to our city govt. Probably enough support here to get Mr.L over the hump. Hopefully that chhange will re-surface tonight as common sense could prevail. At least a re-working of the financial arrangements.
 
As for Josh's troll--don't feed him.
I have a pretty good idea as to who it might be.
nbd
 
your turn in the sunshine down there 2nite
 
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rngrmed View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote rngrmed Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug 17 2010 at 10:02am
I'm on break from school and curious about attending.  What time is a good time to be down there?  Hopefully the schedule will allow it as the day goes on...
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randy View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote randy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug 17 2010 at 11:59am
the meeting starts at 5:30pm  so at like 5:15 is a good time. hope to see you there
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randy View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote randy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug 17 2010 at 9:18pm

I am completely disgusted with my city leaders and in fact with the residents of this city, at least the ones that have spoke out against the Art project. With the exception of two brave men no one spoke out against this. While there at least 30 people that stood up and spoke in favor of it. In fact so many spoke out in favor of this I didn't have enough video to record it, so I just gave up.

 

I am in no way against this project; I am against my tax money funding it. If people really think that this project will save Middletown then you have lost your minds. I am also disgusted with one man for making his wife stand up and talk about how great this project will be, while he stood on the wall watching. What a coward to send your wife to do your dirty work.

 

 

Where were all the people that have talked so bravely on the Journal and on here about this project being a waste of money?? In my opinion no one can say anything more about this, with the exception of the two men that showed up and spoke up. What a let down people, I expected more.

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rngrmed View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote rngrmed Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug 17 2010 at 10:13pm
Some can't attend because of scheduling conflicts, family obligations, etc.  As far as though speaking for the project.  I don't think any of them gave any evidence that the project should be funded by anything other than the business owner or investor.  Hell, there was no diversity of those for the project.  They were all part of the historical society, if no one noticed.  Until the lady from the Middletown Community Arts spoke up I forgot Middletown had this.  In 30 years of living here, I've never been.  I wonder if anyone considered looking at how many pass through their doors daily/weekly/monthly/yearly.  That may be a good indication on the need for this project.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Rhodes Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug 17 2010 at 10:46pm
The reason nobody goes is because we all know the system is locked in place. There will never be any real change until the structure of Middletown government is changed. What happened tonight is why Middletown is the way it is. Middletown has always had a clique of people that are not wealthy, but like to act like they are. They want to pretend they are living a cultured life, but cannot afford to do it in the real world. They come up with these tax paying projects and then gang up together. Think about it, not one person that spoke in favor of this tonight has any type of impressive income or net worth. It's all middle class wanna-be's. What that "clique" doesn't seem to know is that in wealthier neighborhoods, they all "donate" out of their big bank accounts for their cultured events. Can you imagine someone from Indian Hill proposing a project for that community and asking the local government to fund it? Or in Hyde Park or Mt. Adams? It just wouldn't happen. It would be too humiliating. But not these locals in our great city, they have no shame. They want to have wine & cheese parties, pretend they are cultured, but doing it with our tax dollars. This little clique in town is no different than anyone on welfare or even a pan handler. And to all of you supporters of this, nobody is impressed with your little wine parties. We think you are as big of a loser as you know deep down inside that you are.

I've said it before, the way to start major change in this city is to limit council member terms to 1 year at a time so we can get rid of the pathetic ones. There should also be a system set up that reports online the activities of all public employees of any kind. I want to see who gets what, what they did to earn it, etc. You get the public's hand in control of who is actually running this city, make them accountable publicly for every single thing they do, change will happen. If it's good enough for teachers, why not all government employees?

The system in place right doesn't allow for dissenting voices. I've seen how nasty they are to anyone that stands there and asks them questions during council meetings. If you all remember a few years ago, there were so many people showing up to oppose things, they ended up taking it off tv so the public couldn't see what was going on at council meetings.

I drive around town and am amazed at the mess just about everywhere I go. If it's not litter, it's poorly maintained properties. For those of you that live here and do most of your activities here, take a road trip some weekend to other communities. See how other cities operate. How clean other towns are. The differences are mind boggling.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote rngrmed Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug 17 2010 at 11:22pm
Great post Rhodes...Amazing how the historic society wants everything put off on the tax payer.  I know there are different funds in the budget, but its amazing just a couple weeks ago there was no money to cut grass.  Now they have $200k plus a building to give away.  Didn't we (the tax payers) just pass a levy because there was no money for firefighters and policemen?  Yet we give a guy this kind of money to open studios for artists?  Are people going to come here because there are art studios or because the city of Middletown is giving away money to open businesses that the owener can walk away from without penalty? 
I also noticed how King Larry looked disgusted as Ms. Scott-Jones was clarifying the facts on the assessment case.  He kept rolling his eyes and lookinig the other way in disgust.  Kind of like the King made promises he can't keep. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote randy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug 18 2010 at 4:34am
You are right Rhodes, these groups that want this art center here a bunch of "look at me I have money" type of people. When in reality they are just middle class folks trying to fool everyone. The real rich folks would never ask the tax payer to fund this, there would be a fund raiser of sorts to raise money.
 
I just cant wrap my mind around why our city leaders would go for this, I think when this art center does open we middleclass and even low income should attend and get a little culture in our lives.  I mean get out your best pair of blue jeans and a fancy t-shirt throw on that ball cap and go see some of this great art that will save our city.
 
I wonder if they will serve Bush Light at these parties??
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote VietVet Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug 18 2010 at 6:27am
Was there last night for an hour or so. Couldn't take much more of the atmosphere. Too many "cultured" people to suit my taste. While listening to some of the pro-arts folks, I was often amazed at their thinking. Some implied that this arts center would be the "savior" of the downtown area by bringing in jobs that would stimulate activity and promote other businesses in locating down there. I can't see this place creating enough jobs nor any high paying jobs that would provide anyone with a decent standard of living.

We had Doug Bean say his piece. We had Mike Scorti get up and do the "rah-rah" thing for the project. We had the Beau Verre owner read some pro arts notes saying he was pleased the city gave him a loan to start a business and is "excited" that this arts thing is coming. (What he didn't say is when he intends to start paying the 50 grand back to the city). We had some other "artzy-fartzy" people stand up and ramble on about how "delightful" this will be. Even saw an elderly couple from the Highlands "Historical" area voice their support. They should know better. Not one of them seemed to be concerned that it was taxpayer money being used to support a private endeavor. Amazing! Most appeared not to have a clue about the real world. Everything to them is ice cream cakes and sugar plum fairies. Mercy, how out of touch can a person be with what is going on around them?

Council will approve this, probably based on the small number of supporters (that seemed like an overwhelming number compared to the anti-arts people who were basically no-shows)) there last night, even though that small number DOES NOT represent the majority in this town. The small special interest group will win out again and the majority of the citizens will be ignored as to their wants and needs for their city. Council also has an obligation to the MMF'ers to do as they are told and if the MMF'ers want this crap, council will be the good service dogs that they are and provide it for them. Saw Ken Cohen in the audience. Isn't he an MMF'er? Probably there to see that things go correctly as to the decisions. Sorry to say I graduated high school with him and played ball at Smith Park back in the 50's with him. Seemed like a nice person then. He is now the enemy. Another mistake and money mismanagement situation for the city. JMO
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote What A City Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug 18 2010 at 11:46am
What happened to everyone last night? The anti- MUSA Clown's are beating us up on the lack of support for all the "griping" (their words) we do on this site. This turnout only supported their claim that we only sit behind a screen and complain.
 
How about some E-Mails from everyone to all councilmembers expressing our displeasure at their decision on Pendleton approval to satisfy a few artzy folks that comprise less than 5% of the city's population. Be sure and ask Smith. Laubach and Scott- Jones why they  went along with this "Lake Middletown/ City Centre Mall" scenario. Ask them why they decided to take such a huge risk with our money to help a private investor. Scott- Jones has already gone on record that if this doesn't work out we can track her down. Heck of a statement to make as to the confidence level she has for this fiasco. Josh and AJ? I don't know if they will respond or not anymore. I think AJ is afraid to speak nowadays. Josh?-- looks like he's changed his tune from when he started. Someone's taken the starch out of his shorts. Big%20smile So much for any resistance we had counted on. Bet old Mulligan, Becker, lawyer boy and Picard are wettin' their britches about now with delight, now that they have made their bosses happy. Big%20smile
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote randy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug 18 2010 at 11:53am
What A City, you are spot on about getting our butt's kicked. People have to stand up and be heard, who cares if they are listening or not. 27 people spoke in favor of this art center last night, if 27 had spoke against as well we could very well be talking about a different vote today. But we will never know because people just wont show up and speak up.
 
If this subject wasn't enough to get them down there then nothing will!!!! SAD SAD SAD!!!
 
Thanks for your post What a City!! I agree 100%
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote spiderjohn Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug 18 2010 at 2:13pm
Hey--I didn't attend because I knew exactly what would happen. 50 more speakers against the project wouldn't have changed a vote already cast. I love Mike and Vet, however both were terrible last night. Rambling,stammering, and un-prepared after all of this time. Steve Lewis was well-intentioned but not much better. I didn't even watch the Council discussion or vote. The smug attitude of the artsy tax $ spenders and the after-quotes were very disappointing. Gloating is a very bad trait.
 
So--it is done. Let's hope that we were wrong and this deal works for everyone.
 
Do I still believe in Mr.Smith, Mr.Laubaugh, Mr.Allen and Ms.Scott Jones?
No way--sos
Might as well have Leslie,Tony and some other  shills up there
Emailed all Councilmembers--nice responses from Ms.Scott Jones and Mayor Mulligan
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote VietVet Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug 18 2010 at 3:21pm
HEY! Sorry to have disappointed you spider in my delivery and content. Was there, just trying to contribute, that's all. Never said I was a master orator and statesman that you had envisioned. I'll go to the end of the line and sulk. I know my place now as you have put me there- and I thank you for it! Glad you appreciated my time at the podium.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote spiderjohn Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug 18 2010 at 3:45pm
hey vet--I VERY MUCH appreciate your effort and desire exhibited last night.
Took balls to get up there like General Custer at Little Big Horn.
Would have been very easy to be distracted from the way that the comments were structured.
DON'T POUT about it!!
You did what you could--as you know, the city building cronies and their blood-sucking enablers ALWAYS get their way eventually. Council is intimidated and putty in their hands.
 
The hydraulic canal is still filled with the stagnant green scum that has been there for decades.
The sewer stench as you walk along Main St.. is worse than ever, particularly in the area where the garage used to be. The Main St.Project properties owned by the big hitters have been filthy and un-sanitary for years. The Sorg Mansion and Sorg Opera House? lol if it doesn't make you cry. Hope House is better kept.
 
So--give away another million dollars of taxpayer money, then raise water/sewer rates(un-mandated/hidden tax) because the city has no chance of getting a tax increase by the voters.
What about an "art tax"?
Particularly in that new area? Maybe pay for the Main St.Project also.
A special tax on municipally-funded businesses.
That way, those supporting the area giveaways and related businesses return the taxpayer favor.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Vivian Moon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug 18 2010 at 4:40pm
Thanks to Mike & Terry for speaking up at the council meeting last night. Thumbs%20Up
Nothing would have changed the outcome of this vote.

I was glad to see that Mr. Picard spoke up last night about the airport cost not breaking even. Thumbs%20Up
Hmmm...wonder what he will say about Weather Wax costing the tax payers $250,000 a year.

Thanks to Anita Scott Jones Thumbs%20Up and Josh Laubach Thumbs%20Upfor putting a stop to the Historic Commission new powers.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote spiderjohn Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug 18 2010 at 5:20pm
Rhodes made an excellent point that should not be missed.
In the areas where the "arts" are most successful and best supported, they are privately funded.
As mentioned, the public "pay the way" approach would never be considered because that pretty much means that the overall community won't be able to use and purchase the product.
 
This whole bit of pockets of business/property owners holding on until the taxpayer funds their projects and improves their properties is out of hand currently in Middietown. The Main St.Project will put it all over the top, and is basically un-realistic.
 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote VietVet Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug 18 2010 at 5:57pm
Hey Randy- there's some moron with a screen name of Amused To Death, that loves hammering the MUSA folks. He must frequent this site and seems to know some of the more familiar names. Anyway to find out who this clown is? Probably a city official or some MMF smarta-- that likes to stir the pot, unlike us.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote randy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug 18 2010 at 6:28pm
Where are they posting at Vet?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Hermes Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug 18 2010 at 6:45pm
I have to apologize for my absence at the meeting on Tuesday night,my time is spent in Indiana on family matters 3 weeks out of every month so sorry I wasn't there folks.
 
I take it that it did not go well from the postings here.
No more democrats no more republicans,vote Constitution Party !!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mike_Presta Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug 18 2010 at 7:05pm
Spider,
 
Thank you for the love (Embarrassed) and other kind remarks.
 
I'm sorry that my skills as a speechifyer failed to live up to your expectations.  In my younger days, I used to be able to do better, but, alas, I am old and in failing health.  I could list a number of reasons and/or excuses why my debating skills have deteriorated, but there is really nothing to be gained in doing so.
 
Suffice it to say that I attempt to "answer with the best that is within me"!
“Mulligan said he ... doesn’t believe they necessarily make the return on investment necessary to keep funding them.” …The Middletown Journal, January 30, 2012
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote VietVet Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Aug 18 2010 at 7:52pm
Randy- check out today's Midd. Journal. Go to the story on the Pendleton approval by council. Read the posts under Amused to Death to get the jest of his message. Seems to have a chip on the shoulder for us MUSA people. Just wondered if he participates here on this site also.
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