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Dora Bronston: Middletown Area NAACP Opposes SB5 |
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Middletown News
Prominent MUSA Citizen Joined: Apr 29 2008 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 1100 |
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Posted: Apr 04 2011 at 8:44pm |
Dr. Dora Bronston is the Middletown Area NAACP Chapter President. She describes the reasons why the Middletown Area Chapter opposes SB5. This speech was held during a SB5 Protest outside the Pendleton Art Center in Middletown, Ohio where Mayor Larry Mulligan was scheduled to deliver his state of the city address.
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Bocephus
MUSA Citizen Joined: Jun 04 2009 Status: Offline Points: 838 |
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So is she saying that MLK fought for collective bargaining rights? And all these years I thought he was fighting for civil right.
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VietVet
MUSA Council Joined: May 15 2008 Status: Offline Points: 7008 |
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Bronston mentions collective bargaining helped many workers keep their jobs. I have never had collective bargaining in over 40 years of working and have been able to keep the jobs I have had. It is not a requirement to keep a job. In the three instances where I lost my jobs, P&G wouldn't have recognized collective bargaining anyway for research personnel. General Cable was downsizing due to poor business decisions by the CEO (lost quarterly revenues) and Black Clawson was shutting down the research facility on Jefferson St. None of these instances would have been helped by collective bargaining. Bottom line, Ms. Bronston, if the company is bound and intent on eliminating your position, collective bargaining doesn't help a bit.
SB5 is about economics and asking the union workers to pay more for their benefits and retirement so as not to bust the budgets of cities and states if increased, non-affordable demands are on the table. It is about making it a more level playing field with the non-union workers. Kasich is asking the union folks to absorb more of their costs, a practice we non-union people were asked to do years ago by our employers. Union people are not being asked to do anymore, or any less than the majority of workers in this country. The reason the union says it's an assault on working families is that it threatens their way of life even though they have had it better than most non-union folks for decades. It's time they joined the rest of us. Earn your raises on the merit of work you accomplished, not on automatic raises/step increases for work not seen as yet. Pay your fair share, put in your time, enjoy the ride toward retirement, being thankful all along you had a job to go to. |
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TonyB
MUSA Citizen Joined: Jan 12 2011 Location: Middletown, OH Status: Offline Points: 631 |
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Vet - I must disagree with you concerning what SB5 is all about. Anyone can talk a good game, look at what the real effects would be and it is clearly a union-busting ploy. Public worker unions have already recognized that they would have to pay more for their benefits and change the parameters of pay and benefits. This bill strips them of rights guaranteed by federal law and will more than likely have to be litigated in court; which , of course means more expense, political points to be gained or lost and worst of all, no real solution to this situation. If your way of life is threatened, you're going to fight back regardless of the merits of your case or whether it's "fair" or not. The idea that public workers should "join the rest of us' sounds like class warfare or class envy. Once again, the rich rob us blind while we fight and scrap for the leftovers. The idea that we should somehow be "thankful" that we even have a job is a slap in the face to everyone who wants to pursue life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. Without jobs, how would the rich be able to enjoy the fruits of the labor of others?
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Bill
MUSA Citizen Joined: Nov 04 2009 Status: Offline Points: 710 |
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Tony, we know why the SB5 haters out there want to keep collective bargaining. But what the haters out there fail to answer is the public policy argument -- why should we have an economic system where a government job is akin to winning a mini-lottery, a voucher to a prestigious private school or being told your cancer is in remission. No worries, minimal stress. Why should public workers who do good work but most are not exceptionally gifted or in the upper echelons of the country's great thinkers, and doing jobs that do not require a union at all in that there are no safety issues, continue to be able to coast on (relatively) Easy Street while the rest of society rides the good ship Rough Seas?
Is the "saving the middle class" argument supposed to resonate with all those who are no longer there? or working 60 hours just to stay there?
We know why you want collective bargaining. But we should the rest of us?
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TonyB
MUSA Citizen Joined: Jan 12 2011 Location: Middletown, OH Status: Offline Points: 631 |
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Bill - thank you for your post. I should clear up one thing for you; I do not "want" collective bargaining. In my present situation, collective bargaining does nothing for me, personally. I understand that many see public employment as a "lottery win". I would venture a guess that public employees don't see it the same way but that is a perception problem. If people would take a moment and try to see this through the eyes of another, a reasonable solution could be proposed. IMO, most controversial issues could be solved to better outcomes if this approach were used.
I never have understood the idea that "the other guy has it easier than me". The idea you express that public workers who do good work but aren't exceptionally gifted or are not great thinkers don't deserve a union because they don't have jobs with safety issues makes no sense to me. Are you saying that only jobs with safety issues should have unions? Are you advocating that workers should not even have a choice whether to unionize? Even more disturbing to me is the assertion that somehow, public employees "coast on (relatively) Easy Street". Ask those CEO's at the major corporations if they are riding the good ship "Rough Seas". I think we all know the answer to that one.
What is the most disturbing to me is the idea that "saving the middle class" is somehow being done on the backs of those no longer there. If that is not class envy, I don't know what else you would call it. I get it, the private sector has been decimated by corporations and trade agreements that make American manufacturing uncompetitive. That is not the fault of the public employee. The politician and corporation who point fingers at who is to blame turn private sector workers against public sector workers while they get a free pass and expanded profits. In case you hadn't noticed, corporate profits are at an all-time high!!! While all of this is happening, the middle class is being destroyed for both public and private sector workers. You ask why should the rest of workers want collective bargaining? Because it protects workers from unreasonable demands by employers and provides a framework for productivity. I have a serious problem with unions that protect their membership instead of insuring that a union employee is a quality employee. That is their challenge. The idea that no one should be protected if I'm not sounds like someone wanting to pull everyone down. However well intentioned, SB5 does nothing but strip workers of their rights. If they get away with for public unions, the private unions are next!
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VietVet
MUSA Council Joined: May 15 2008 Status: Offline Points: 7008 |
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TonyB...
"Vet - I must disagree with you concerning what SB5 is all about. Anyone can talk a good game, look at what the real effects would be and it is clearly a union-busting ploy"- not necessarily clear to me, Tony. The argument that the demands of today's unions are busting the bank on states and cities is not unreasonable to assume. According to the Middletown budget, union costs comprise a large percentage of that budget. Gotta get that cost down. "This bill strips them of rights guaranteed by federal law" And what rights would that be? Do non-union workers have those same rights? Very little rights in the workplace to sink your teeth into. In 1994, two of us Vietnam vets, out of a group of 24, were downsized by P&G. The act of 1974, posted in most workplaces, states that Vietnam era vets are suppose to be fostered and assisted. We two were assisted alright. Assisted out the door. When I reported this to the Chicago office, I was told that they would "check into it" during their next audit. That was 1994. Guess they're still "checking into it" This is a law in the workplace that clearly has no teeth and is a joke at best. "If your way of life is threatened, you're going to fight back regardless of the merits of your case or whether it's "fair" or not." Way of life? You mean little cost to you for health, eye, dental insurance? Tenure/seniority instead of merit? Step Increases instead of merit? Walking off the job at any time if your union bosses call for a strike? Hard for me to support "your way of life" right now considering "my way of life" as a non-union worker. We didn't "fight back" when the company said we are now going to start paying more of the premiums on our benefits. We never fought back when we were told our raise would be based on merit....seniority/tenure/step increases were never a part of the raise procedure. You do what you have to do to keep a decent job to pay the bills and cross your fingers they keep you around long enough to draw an adequate retirement to supplement your Social Security. "The idea that we should somehow be "thankful" that we even have a job is a slap in the face to everyone who wants to pursue life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness"- Yeah, you go talk to the people who have been unemployed for a year or two (or longer) and tell them that and see what kind of reaction you get. They would be thankful for any job in today's shi--- economy. Can't pick and chose. Just survive until it gets better. "Without jobs, how would the rich be able to enjoy the fruits of the labor of others?" The rich just take their company, pack up and leave to cheaper labor (non-union) and leave the union people who insisted on all these demands in the unemployment line in the same situation described in the paragraph above. You can't fight the employer and you can't protest too vehemently. Your company just may pack up and leave to relocate to a place where the people appreciate having a job at a much lower cost in wages and bennies. Tony, the union people need to realize that no matter how much we workers want to resist the company actions, it is still their company and they can pack it in anytime they please, leaving you with nothing except the possibility of losing everything you worked for all these years. Do union people want that? If not, I suggest they cool their jets, especially now with jobs so hard to find. Word to the wise....do not protest too loudly. It may come back to bite you in the ---.JMO |
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Bill
MUSA Citizen Joined: Nov 04 2009 Status: Offline Points: 710 |
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I agree with you that something is amiss with executive pay. And the concentration of wealth to the top 1% in this country over the last 20 years (despite all the screams about excessive regulation and taxes from the wealthy elites) is unfortunate. While it may be legal it doesn't feel right. Much like the apathy of Middletown some of the blame lies with the apathy of shareholders who allow boards to throw pots of gold at executives, some of whom are barely capable of running a Starbucks. I wonder if the comp decisions are: CEO Jones is paid X, therefore we have to pay CEO Smith X ++.
But you're making the discussion an issue of public employees vs CEOs when the more direct issue is public employees vs the public who pays for their services. Why is it difficult for the unions to understand that the people who pay them, the same people who are unemployed to the tune of 15-18% real unemployment, the same people whose average wages have been stagnant or worse for 10+ years, don't have the $$ or stomach to continue paying for a system of relative privilege and insulated tenure-ocracy. All this while the unions idea of sacrifice is "hey, we'll take a wage freeze for a year" -- gee, that solves everything.
Public unions are like the house guest who stays too long, eats up your food, uses your laundry, all while you're out struggling to find a job.
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VietVet
MUSA Council Joined: May 15 2008 Status: Offline Points: 7008 |
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TonyB...
"Ask those CEO's at the major corporations if they are riding the good ship "Rough Seas". I think we all know the answer to that one". No, the CEO's never have had to ride the good ship Rough Seas. But the workers under them have had their fair share of time in the water with no life preservers nor life boats. The workers have been left to fend for themselves at different times the past 30+ years. The worker gets downsized and they wonder where their next meal will come from much less how they are going to pay the bills or keep the house from being foreclosed. The CEO, when released from a company wonders whether their vacation between jobs will be in Fiji or the Bahamas due to the massive buyouts for them in their contracts. For them, there is plenty of money until the next high roller position floats their way and they can screw up another company. Like school superintendents, some CEO's make the rounds leaving destruction and desolation in their path. "Are you advocating that workers should not even have a choice whether to unionize?" Go ahead and unionize. You'll show'em who's boss. Until they decide to leave or replace you with cheaper non-union workers. (Refer to AK Steel's last strike and the outcome thereof) Tony, in this economy, with cost-cutting measures being put into place in every company, it would be virtual job security suicide to unionize. Better to have a job making decent wages than try for great wages and find yourself standing in the unemployment line reading in the paper that your company has decided to relocate to cheaper pastures. "You ask why should the rest of workers want collective bargaining? Because it protects workers from unreasonable demands by employers and provides a framework for productivity". Again, always worked in a non-union shop. Never had to have collective bargaining to avoid "unreasonable demands" from the employer and the non-union environment has always created a "framework for productivity". You know the best framework for productivity? Working in a profit sharing company. The harder you work and the more productive you are without rework, the more you get in that profit sharing check, which is separate from you regular paychecks. When I worked at Crane Plastics, a profit sharing company, we worked long hours every summer. We also got checks for several thousand dollars back them too. Several thousand dollars went a long way in the 70's. "The politician and corporation who point fingers at who is to blame turn private sector workers against public sector workers while they get a free pass and expanded profits. In case you hadn't noticed, corporate profits are at an all-time high!!!" In today's working world, Tony, IMO, one should worry about their own household and how they're going to make it rather than to trouble themselves about how much the company made. If the company made alot of money, and I have a decent paying job, allowing me to pay my bills on time, and I'm not standing in the unemployment line or looking for a job for two years, I'm happy I have another day to go somewhere....to work. If you've been downsized, especially multiple times, you may think the same. The guy across the street from me has been out of work for two years. Technician at AK Research for 20+ years. All gone for him. Now, just looking for anything, even minimum wage jobs......and can't find one of those either. Guys, appreciate what you have. It could be worse. |
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TonyB
MUSA Citizen Joined: Jan 12 2011 Location: Middletown, OH Status: Offline Points: 631 |
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Bill and Vet - In the middle of answering Bill's response, Vet must have posted and my computer glitched and I lost everything I'd written. Hate it when that happens!!! lol
There is absolutely no doubt that the present situation is unsustainable. That is not the real issue involved with the law.(Since it has passed, it's no longer just a bill) No matter how the governor or supporters wish to sugar-coat it, this is a union-busting bill whose purpose is to weaken unions and the Democratic Party in the state of Ohio. Anyone who has read posts that I have written know that I am not a supporter of either party. Bill's assertion that this is public workers vs the public they serve is just not true. Elected leaders at all levels of government agreed to these contracts for public workers. Should these workers have said no thanks, we'll just take less? Show me an instance where that happens.
I am not making the discussion about public workers vs CEO's. On the contrary, what has happened is that politicians and CEO's have the public worker pitted against the private sector worker for the scraps that are left after record profits and bonuses and campaign contributions have been doled out. While we fight about who's at fault, they laugh all the way to their 2nd vacation home!!! Vet - if everyone is just out for himself, what kind of community will there be? It will be Darwin on steroids, only the strong survive, get out of my way, you have what I want and I'm taking it from you. Is that the America we have become?
I will say it again; we need a sensible, non-partisan discussion about these problems. The people have been betrayed by our elected representatives and employers whose only thought is profit at all costs. When everyone is out for themselves, none but the strongest or richest move ahead while the rest fight in the gutter. Somehow, that has to change.
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VietVet
MUSA Council Joined: May 15 2008 Status: Offline Points: 7008 |
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TonyB...."No matter how the governor or supporters wish to sugar-coat it, this is a union-busting bill whose purpose is to weaken unions and the Democratic Party in the state of Ohio".
Tony, I am a registered Democrat and I don't think this is an assault on the Dems nor the unions. I think there is a real need to re-examine public union benefits on behalf of the taxpayers who are footing the bill. I also believe there is sufficient proof that cities and states are having a rough go of it and that part of the reason is costs for public employee wages and bennies. "Elected leaders at all levels of government agreed to these contracts for public workers" Yea Tony, but the PEOPLE who elected these so-called leaders didn't agree with it and they are the ones footing the bills. Elected leaders, nine times out of ten, do not speak for the people. The only reason most of them are in office is because there is no other decent choices to make when you're standing there punching buttons at the booth. Your choices are incompetent and more incompetent. "Vet - if everyone is just out for himself, what kind of community will there be?" Tony, my message in that was to tend to your own business and leave everybody alone. Don't know about you, but aside from this forum (which is a stress reliever/venting mechanism for me), I don't have time to worry about things outside my control and outside my realm of influence. With two jobs one forty hours a week and one with unlimited time on the job, I am doing nicely taking care of my own little world nowadays. "get out of my way, you have what I want and I'm taking it from you. Is that the America we have become?" Yes, in some circles. "The people have been betrayed by our elected representatives and employers whose only thought is profit at all costs". Has been this way since I started working back in 1966. Over time, your statement about employers whose only thought is profit at all costs has grown in importance for them. You really didn't think you mattered to the employer did you? Tony, come on now. Please don't be so naive. You are a number, a pair of hands, to do what they train you to do. That's all it has been for 30 years. Classic example- AK Steel. Back when it was home-grown Armco, the bosses came out on the floor, knew everyone by name and asked about the family, at least giving the impression they really cared. Now, none of that happens. It is no longer "home-grown/locally owned and run with your friends progressing through the ranks. It is cold, hard, and unemotional in the workplace. Treat it as such and you'll live longer. "When everyone is out for themselves, none but the strongest or richest move ahead while the rest fight in the gutter" Theme here in Middletown. Citizen apathy encourages the strongest/richest to move ahead while the rest fight in the gutter. |
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TonyB
MUSA Citizen Joined: Jan 12 2011 Location: Middletown, OH Status: Offline Points: 631 |
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Vet - I've returned from the upstairs council work session meeting and about 20 minutes of the council meeting. I never could sit on those torture devices they call seats there. I sat and re-read your posts and mine on this thread and would like to expand and amend my previous remarks. (I think that's one of them fancy government phrases that you pick up, lol)
I see where your thinking is in relation to SB5 and what you perceive as the need for state and local governments to control spending. After watching the work session (admittedly, this was the first) , I was struck by how much of the budget costs are personnel and how flat revenues are. What was glaring to me, was the amount of uncertainty there is because of all the changes and proposed changes in Columbus. It is difficult to give our leaders good financial advice when there is absolutely no certainty about what is happening. I could have asked questions for an hour and not been able to put together any coherent idea as of today about what to do. these people have these meetings every 2 weeks and I could tell that they were a little shell-shocked by the decisions on the budget without any credible figures to back it up. What struck me was that the city's fiscal year and the state's fiscal year are not the same. I don't think this is an indictment of our finance director either because he laid it out straight, that there were going to be decisions to make for the next budget and it's not a very clear picture from the state about how much money will be coming in. They decided that they wanted to have a special public session devoted to that in May. Hopefully, by then the state will have made some decisions. Otherwise, if I were council, I'd get out a dart board to make decisions.
This hasn't changed my position on SB5, if anything it has strengthened my opposition only because of the uncertainty and devisiveness its caused. One thing is very clear though, whatever you might think about the bill, it was meant to polarize this state. In that, it has succeeded.
I will admit my complete surprise at how few members of the public attend city council sessions. I know it is on TV Middletown; I'm curious how many people watch their local government in action. The seats, even with the padding, are uncomfortable. I doubt I could actually sit through an entire meeting. I was also surprised that there was only one speaker, me. For everyone on this blog who complains about our city, if you really want to be heard, go to a meeting and sign up to speak. Write down what you're going to say, don't get personal or attack someone's character or integrity (unless, of course, that's why you want to speak to council) The mayor gave me my three minutes and said thank you let's move on. I really have no idea if what I said was worth the breath to utter it or the paper to write it on but if nothing else, I feel better getting those particular sentiments off my chest. Kinda therapeutic, if you know what I mean. It also should be easy because this council doesn't seem to be getting much feedback, at least in public during the people's business. I doubt they read these blogs too much because they certainly aren't very flattering toward our council. If you're an elected official you should realize that criticism is just part of the job; I'm not really sure that they count on public apathy or not but it was in evidence tonight. I am hoping that this was an aberation and that more people show up to regualr council meetings.
The thing that really struck me in your post is you state that elected leaders don't speak for the people. That was pretty much what my three minutes with council was about. Now I'm struck with the disconnect between the people and their leaders. You get elected by slick word play and sound bites and then the public forgets about you unless you get arrested, promoted, resign or get reelected. Voters want the familiar sounding name and someone else to take care of it. I'm not sure if the voting public can be shaken out of this apathetic stupor but if it doesn't happen soon, it won't matter.
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VietVet
MUSA Council Joined: May 15 2008 Status: Offline Points: 7008 |
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TonyB..
You write: "For everyone on this blog who complains about our city, if you really want to be heard, go to a meeting and sign up to speak. Write down what you're going to say, don't get personal or attack someone's character or integrity (unless, of course, that's why you want to speak to council) The mayor gave me my three minutes and said thank you let's move on". And your last line says it all when speaking to council. THE MAYOR GAVE ME MY THREE MINUTES AND SAID THANK YOU LET"S MOVE ON. Repeat.....thank you, let's move on. No feedback, no answers, even when you look them in the eye and ask for one. They all sit there like a toad on a log, do not respond, act like you're bothering them, give you the impression they want you go talk fast and get it over with. It is a waste of time to participate in Citizens Comments for these reasons. I'm surprised you didn't get the classic "We are not prepared to answer you (or to respond) at this time" from Mulligan. Standard, programmed response from him as mayor. Pathetic, IMO, not to want to engage a citizen who requests an answer to their questions. "It also should be easy because this council doesn't seem to be getting much feedback" Oh, they're getting feedback alright. It's not what they want to hear, giving them a reason to ignore the people, which they are good at. "I doubt they read these blogs too much because they certainly aren't very flattering toward our council" They read this forum. Mr. Laubach and Mr. Picard are card-carrying members. Ms. Scott-Jones was a participant until she decided she didn't want to discuss things anymore. Smith was on here for awhile. Don't think Becker ever was, but shouldn't surprise anyone. He doesn't care what people think of him. Pompous a-- in my opinion. Mulligan....he's too lost in his rose-colored stupor to ascertain what people are saying about him. Allen....completely detached from any connection with the people. Seems aloof and lost in space. Very ineffective as a councilman. Just breathing and doing what he is told as most are doing. "If you're an elected official you should realize that criticism is just part of the job" Especially the way they do their job. They beg to be criticized (and recalled) The Four Horsemen are You Tube fodder for the most part. "I'm not really sure that they count on public apathy or not but it was in evidence tonight". They love public apathy. Keeps the people at home, not caring, non-attentive to how badly they are screwing up this city. They loath us here because we watch every move they make and critique any decision they make. They don't like oversight in their activities because they have things to hide and want their hidden agenda to remain out of sight while they make the decisions about the city that the MMF'ers want them to make. "I am hoping that this was an aberation and that more people show up to regualr council meetings". In all honesty, doubtful. Most don't care enough to show. Those that care won't show either as they know it is an exercise in futility to talk to a group of people who are as receptive as talking to a wall. They won't change. Neither will some of us. We will never agree with each other on the way this town is being run. "The thing that really struck me in your post is you state that elected leaders don't speak for the people" Middletown leaders are the poster children for the "not speaking for the people" theme. They were put on council/in the city building and speak for their overseers, the MMF'ers, a small, yet influential group of old guard powerbrokers who want Middletown to go their way to protect their little private turf. "Voters want the familiar sounding name and someone else to take care of it. I'm not sure if the voting public can be shaken out of this apathetic stupor but if it doesn't happen soon, it won't matter." IMO. the only way to turn this town around is to purge the current members of council who take orders from the MMF'ers, resit new members who have no hidden agenda, who will tell the MMF'ers to go pound salt up their keester, then start the purge of the city building program with the city manager, the planning director, law director and others going first, replacing them with competent, no hidden agenda, no MMF intimidating traits people. THEN, we start the different direction and start undoing all this crap they have in place now with emphasis on roads and infrastructure first, with a solid econ.devel. department, which has been gutted and restocked with competent people who will actually work on getting decent jobs in here, while the new planning department, under competent leadership, starts REALLY being BUSINESS FRIENDLY. JMO |
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TonyB
MUSA Citizen Joined: Jan 12 2011 Location: Middletown, OH Status: Offline Points: 631 |
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Vet - thank you for your perspective on the city. It always helps to see things through different eyes.
I'm not surprised by council reaction to citizen comments in general and mine specifically. If they got anything, I hope it was the idea that when government oversteps its bounds, it becomes a problem.
I hope council members do read these blogs. There are some useful observations about our city in here and whether you agree or disagree isn't relevant. It's point of view from multiple angles that provides clarity of vision.
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