VAULT AT CEMETERY

Message Topic Search Topic Options Post Reply Create New Topic Printable Version Translate Topic

The Middletown Journal took some wonderful pictures of the Vault at the Middletown Cemetery...
http://projects.middletownjournal.com/cache/galleries/News/Local/041309cemetary/

Author	Message Topic Search Topic Options Post Reply Create New Topic Printable Version Translate Topic
Vivian Moon Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List MUSA Council Joined: May 16 2008 Location: Middletown, Ohi Status: Offline Points: 4187	Post Options Post Reply Quote Vivian Moon Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Topic: VAULT AT CEMETERY Posted: Apr 14 2009 at 5:32am
	The Middletown Journal took some wonderful pictures of the Vault at the Middletown Cemetery... http://projects.middletownjournal.com/cache/galleries/News/Local/041309cemetary/

Vivian Moon Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List MUSA Council Joined: May 16 2008 Location: Middletown, Ohi Status: Offline Points: 4187	Post Options Post Reply Quote Vivian Moon Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: Apr 18 2009 at 9:30pm
	City has no funds available for cemetery vault project By Ed Richter Staff Writer Friday, September 21, 2007 Middletown Journal, Middletown, Ohio MIDDLETOWN — It's an important project, but the city just doesn't have the cash to do it. Middletown City Council on Tuesday agreed that the vault in the Middletown Historic Pioneer Cemetery is in need of immediate repair, but they were also cognizant that there is only so much money in the city's budget to pay for special projects. Extras For the past few years, Vivian Moon and others have volunteered to clean up the cemetery where many of Middletown's founders are buried. Moon and the city have recently applied for a grant from the Middletown Community Foundation, but Interim City Manager Steve Husemann said he could not recommend spending $18,700 in city funds as a match for the grant, even though he believed it was "a valid project." The vault is used for storage. The council approved a motion to endorse the project and to encourage others to donate funds or in-kind services and materials for the project that will cost about $65,000 to complete. The foundation is expected to make a decision on the grant in late October, according to Husemann. In other business, the council also: • Approved a motion to send a letter to Gov. Ted Strickland expressing the council's "strong concerns and objections over any 'incentives' or 'abatements' that would offer an undue advantage" to assist a steelmaker interested in locating in Ohio. The letter expressed the council's desire to ensure a level playing field in the steelmaking industry as well as ensuring "AK Steel's ability to compete is not compromised." Russian steelmaker MMK and state officials are discussing the possibility of locating a $1 billion steel mill near Portsmouth that would create 1,000 jobs. • Approved an emergency resolution accepting the amounts and rates approved by the Butler County Budget Commission and authorizing the necessary property tax levies. • Approved a pair of ordinances to increase the city's water and sewer rates over the next three years. If approved, the water rate would go up 5 percent in 2009, while the sewer rate would be increased by 10 percent in 2008 and 5 percent in 2009. The rates also reflect the city's change from a quarterly to a monthly billing schedule. • Approved changes to the city's zoning code regarding downtown development standards. • Approved a lease to allow Butler County to construct an emergency telecommunications tower near the city's Blue Ball water towers. • Went into executive session to discuss contract negotiations. The council's next meeting will be Oct. 2 at the Middletown City Building, One Donham Plaza.

Impala SS Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List MUSA Resident Joined: Jan 12 2009 Location: middletown Status: Offline Points: 136	Post Options Post Reply Quote Impala SS Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: Apr 20 2009 at 1:06pm
	Vivian I was over at the cemetery a few minutes ago and put some small flags at the entrance and at the vault. At least some of us still care about the dead.

Vivian Moon Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List MUSA Council Joined: May 16 2008 Location: Middletown, Ohi Status: Offline Points: 4187	Post Options Post Reply Quote Vivian Moon Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: Apr 24 2009 at 5:33am
	*Impala SS* Thanks for the flags Mr. Kohler at city hall dropped the ball and now Ms Gilleland thinks she can cover it up by tearing down the vault... Here are the CDBG historic funds that were promised to me for the Vault in 2006: http://www.mainstreet.org/MediaLibrary/HUD_Historic_Pres_and_CDBG_Use.pdf

VietVet Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List MUSA Council Joined: May 15 2008 Status: Offline Points: 7008	Post Options Post Reply Quote VietVet Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: Apr 24 2009 at 6:58am
	Vivian- Just thinking about the funding to repair the vault. I view this vault in the same realm as the Canal Museum/South Main St area IE- seems to me that these structures would fall under the historical topic. I wasn't in town when they built the Canal Museum. Thought it was a George Crout project back in the day. Wonder how they funded that project? What is the difference between pulling funds to restore historical mansions on South Main St. and pulling from the same funds to restore the vault in the Pioneer Cemetery or to maintain the Canal Museum? Even the Hydraulic Canal has some historical significance to the town as to industrial importance. The funds are being used for the same purpose- IE restoration of historic structures in town. Too simple?? Not correct??

Vivian Moon Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List MUSA Council Joined: May 16 2008 Location: Middletown, Ohi Status: Offline Points: 4187	Post Options Post Reply Quote Vivian Moon Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: Apr 24 2009 at 9:12am
	I believe that Mr Crout built the Canal Museum with the Middletown Historical Society Funds and all the books that he had written over the years. The CDBG funds were used to supply low % rate loans for all the houses on Main Street plus tax breaks. This same CDBG money was used to restore all the downtown area. This same money can be used to restore the Vault. Plus I believe that the Vault is older than the houses on Main Street ...however it isn't Mr. Kohler's pet project and therefore unworthy of funding....it's not in the right part of town.

VietVet Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List MUSA Council Joined: May 15 2008 Status: Offline Points: 7008	Post Options Post Reply Quote VietVet Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: Apr 24 2009 at 3:23pm
	Vivian- it's still not possible to get the $60 to $85 thousand you need between any Historical Society funds, the CDBG funds, the matching $11,000 grant to Gilleland's $11,000 she thought she could find for you???? Wonder how much the Historical Society paid to have that Canal Museum built? Surely more than to fix the vault. Does the Butler County government chip in to clean and restore the Soldiers and Sailors Monument in Hamilton? Could they be approached to donate to the restoration of the vault in Middletown? County government should be asked to invest in all Butler County cities, not just Hamilton.

VietVet Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List MUSA Council Joined: May 15 2008 Status: Offline Points: 7008	Post Options Post Reply Quote VietVet Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: Jun 21 2009 at 6:28pm
	Vivian- went over to the Pioneer Cemetery today with the wife. We walked around and we finally located the Stillwaugh grave site. You're right about the large half dead evergreen overgrowing the stones. It needs to come out. How would I proceed to have the bush removed? Do I contact the city for permission to remove it, or do I just get my chainsaw and cut it down or hire a crew to come out and remove it at my expense? With the damage to the many stones there, allegedly caused by the kids at night with nothing better to do, wonder what the cost would be to hire a "mall type" night security person to patrol this? I know the city would balk at paying for this. In your opinion, would this security still be needed or have the kids toned down the destruction? The old vault does need a little attention doesn't it? Thanks for caring! Wish the city was as dedicated.

Smokey Burgess Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List MUSA Resident Joined: Jun 04 2009 Status: Offline Points: 172	Post Options Post Reply Quote Smokey Burgess Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: Jun 21 2009 at 9:08pm
	Miss Vivian - It's unfortunate that we don't have more caring, truly civic-minded Middletonians like Viet Vet. Thanks so much for your perseverance in dealing with the elitist bureaucrats at One Donham Plaza. Smokey

spiderjohn Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Prominent MUSA Citizen Joined: Jul 01 2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 2749	Post Options Post Reply Quote spiderjohn Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: Jun 21 2009 at 9:38pm
	Vet--I learned a long time ago, if you see a situation that you need to deal with(in a constructive way), just go ahead and git r done. Don't ask--don't tell. Deal with the consequences after the fact, and there usually won't be any meaningful negative consequences. Y'all should simply fix the cemetary the best that you can. What are "they" going to do? Arrest you and haul you into court for doing a good thing where the municipals have shirked and dropped the ball? Talk about a public relations nightmare that would attract every news agency in the country(except the MJ of course)!

Paul Nagy Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List MUSA Citizen Joined: Jan 11 2009 Status: Offline Points: 384	Post Options Post Reply Quote Paul Nagy Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: Jun 21 2009 at 11:34pm
	Whoa Spider, Lets give this a little more thought. This kind of approach is probably guaranteeing a confrontation that would make things a lot worse. "They" may not arrest you and haul you into court but "they" may not let you or anyone else do anything further to the cemetary. What is it we're trying to accomplish here? I thought we wanted to get the vault restored and the grounds cleaned up and then maintained. This is a "knock the chip off my shoulder" approach. I think we've had enough of that on this and other issues. We've also had enough of personal name calling and issuing ultimatums. It hasn't gotten us anywhere. We need to stick with the issues and keep personalities out of it. I still think that the best approach is to accept the city's offer of $11,000 added to the $11,000 from the Middletown Community Foundation grant. That's $22,000. That's a lot of money. We could do a lot with that for starters. We could fix the door, fix the roof, clean-up some of the stones and a few other things that need to be done. Then let's ask for a committee to come up with a plan to find the rest of the money to restore the vault and do the other things that need to be done. The committee could devise a plan and a time-line as to what needs to be done. Then they could look for grants, volunteers, donations and businesses to help us get the job done. Then the city might even come in with some more money. We all appreciate what Ms. Moon has done over the years and she is to be commended for it but demanding that the city put $60,00 to $80,000 hasn't done anything but cause hard feelings. Lets do what needs to be done and get the job done. Yes, I know and you do too that it is the city's responsiblity. Now that we've said that in concrete it still doesn't get the job done. What has gotten us a step forward is talking and negotiating. What stopped it is issuing ultimatums. I say lets look at the circumstances and all of us act in the cemetaries best interest. We don't need any newspapers or Forbes coming in here and giving us more bad publicity. That's not going to help us attract new businesses and jobs. I recognize that we have all lost our patience but lets get our second wind and get it done right. Please give it more thought. Thank you. Paul Nagy

Vivian Moon Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List MUSA Council Joined: May 16 2008 Location: Middletown, Ohi Status: Offline Points: 4187	Post Options Post Reply Quote Vivian Moon Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: Jun 22 2009 at 6:23am
	Mr. Nagy I would like to respond to each item in your post. Whoa Spider, Lets give this a little more thought. This kind of approach is probably guaranteeing a confrontation that would make things a lot worse. "They" may not arrest you and haul you into court but "they" may not let you or anyone else do anything further to the cemetary. I informed the City in writting February 2009 that I would longer fund or maintain the Middletown Cemetery. However when the cemetery had 6 foot weeds 5 days before Memorial Day I broke down and started pulling the weeds and cleaning it up before Memorial Day for the families. What is it we're here? We're trying to accomplish ???...who's WE I thought we wanted to get the vault restored and the grounds cleaned up and then maintained. Again..who's the WE? The Middletown Cemetery Committee has been working for the past 6 years to get the City to take responsible for the cemtery. We have talked with the City numerous times over the years. We have maintaines and funded this cemetery for 5 years. WHERE HAVE YOU BEEN WHILE WE WERE DIGGING IN THE DIRT. This is a "knock the chip off my shoulder" approach. I think we've had enough of that on this and other issues. We've also had enough of personal name calling and issuing ultimatums. Mr. Nagy, you are more than welcome to your opinion on how you think this matter should have been handled...however you are not very well informed about the facts or history concerning this matter. I have not done any personal name calling other than to state that many in the City did not and are not doing their jobs...however after trying to work with the City for 5 years to solve this problem I did draw the line in the sand at the April Council Meeting. It hasn't gotten us anywhere. We need to stick with the issues and keep personalities out of it. Again..who is US and WE? Stick with the issues? Gosh, Mr. Nagy I believe I have did nothing but stick with the issues and beat the drum for the past 5 years. Where have YOU been? I'll give you pass on the personalities remark. I still think that the best approach is to accept the city's offer of $11,000 added to the $11,000 from the Middletown Community Foundation grant. That's $22,000. That's a lot of money. Again Mr. Nagy, this is your opion and you are welcome to it. Gee, Mr. Nagy if you think $22,000 is a lot of money you must be out of your mind with worry for the $500,000 that they want to spend on the bike path that is in the wrong place. We could do a lot with that for starters. We could fix the door, fix the roof, clean-up some of the stones and a few other things that need to be done. Again Mr. Nagy, you are ill informed on this suject matter. I can't do anything with $22,000. The very first thing that must be done is the stone work for about $36,000. Then let's ask for a committee to come up with a plan to find the rest of the money to restore the vault and do the other things that need to be done. The committee could devise a plan and a time-line as to what needs to be done. Again Mr. Nagy you are not very informed on this issue. The Middletown Cemetery Committee was formed in 2004. In 2005 we presented a a detailed three year plan for the restoration of the grounds and vault at the Middletown Cemetery to the City of Middletown, Middletown Historical Society and the Middletown Community Foundation. Then they could look for grants, volunteers, donations and businesses to help us get the job done. Mr. Nagy the Middletown Community Foundation has given three grants for the restoration of the Middletown Cemetery. If it wasn't for their support it would still be a weed field!...people have given donations and businesses have helped me also. WHERE IS THE BIG CHECK AND SUPPORT FROM THE CITY? WHERE IS THE MIDDLETOWN HISTORICAL SOCIETY AND THEIR SUPPORT? Then the city might even come in with some more money. Mr Nagy, Ms Gilleland clearly stated three times that the City was ONLY going to give $11,000 to the entire restoration of the Middletown Cemetery PERIOD! The 1947 deed clearly states that this property is owned by the City of Middletown. I waited 5 years and I'm still waiting for the City to do the right thing. And then we have that pesky little thing called the LAW. The City was informed that they were not in compliance with ORC 4767 five years ago. The law clearly states that they MUST take care of this cemetery. We all appreciate what Ms. Moon has done over the years and she is to be commended for it but demanding that the city put $60,00 to $80,000 hasn't done anything but cause hard feelings. Mr. Nagy, again you are not informed..cause hard feeling to whom? I would advise before you speak on this matter again you talk with the families that have family buried in this cemetery. They have complained for years about the comdition of this cemetery where their loved ones are buried and the City did nothing. The Middletown Cemetery Committee and other have already invested about $35,000 at the Middletown Cemetery and hundreds of hours of free labor. Lets do what needs to be done and get the job done. Yes, I know and you do too that it is the city's responsiblity. Now that we've said that in concrete it still doesn't get the job done. What has gotten us a step forward is talking and negotiating. What stopped it is issuing ultimatums. Again Mr. Nagy, you need further information on this subject. The Middletown Cemetery Perpetual Fund is missing. Now the City has raided the Middletown Cemetery Fund without my knownledge or permission and they have refused to take care of the cemetery and vault....just what points would YOU like to negotiate on? I say lets look at the circumstances and all of us act in the cemetaries best interest. Mr. Nagy, the Middletown Cemetery Community has ALWAYS ACTED IN THE BEST INTEREST OF THOSE BURIED AT THE MIDDLETOWN CEMETERY. We don't need any newspapers or Forbes coming in here and giving us more bad publicity. Mr. Nagy, they got the bad press because they refuse to take care of the cemetery. That's not going to help us attract new businesses and jobs. Mr. Nagy, those at City Hall have caused the above problems because of their wasteful spending over the years. Mr. Kohler caused us to become the Section 8 City that now can't attract job. Why don't you go to City Hall and solve those little problems. However if you would like to go out and get the $55,000 in donations wiithin the next 30 days that are needed to restore the vault please give me a call and I will be glad to tell you where to deposit the funds. I recognize that we have all lost our patience but lets get our second wind and get it done right. Please give it more thought. Thank you. Paul Nagy Mr. Nagy, I have given it much more than a second thought for the past 3 years. I have now filed against the City of Middletown with the State of Ohio and if that doesn't solve the problems the families of those buried at the Middletown Cemetery will be filing a class act suite against the City. Vivian Moon Chairperson Middletown Cemetery Committee

Vivian Moon Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List MUSA Council Joined: May 16 2008 Location: Middletown, Ohi Status: Offline Points: 4187	Post Options Post Reply Quote Vivian Moon Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: Jun 22 2009 at 7:00am
	Spider I wish it were that simple to work at the cemetery. In 2005 the City had to approve all my design plans for the front area of the cemetery, sign and the underground electrical lines. Ginger Smith gave me permission to do the cleanup. Over the past four years I have been working to clear different areas and fence lines at the cemetery. As well as caring for and watering all the beds during the heat of the summer. Then in the fall I plant the bulbs and iris for springtime. I have sumitted all my design plans to the City for the vault and they have been approved. My design plans for the inside, patio and landscaping of the vault have not been submitted or appoved. I can't touch the vault without the permission of the City.

spiderjohn Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Prominent MUSA Citizen Joined: Jul 01 2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 2749	Post Options Post Reply Quote spiderjohn Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: Jun 22 2009 at 7:04am
	Thanx for yer opinion, Mr.Nagy. We can file it with the opinions of everyone else, which haven't produced anything other than keep us in the "do nothing" "talk talk talk" mode. Vet--if you see problems around yer family's gravesite, you don't need me(or anyone else) to tell you what to do. If it was my situation, I would quietly go there and do the work, leaving quietly. Make no comment--accept no credit for simply doing something constructive, sensible and correct. Kinda plays along with the Middletown Pride approach. Let Mort and Ashworth take the credit-whatever. At least you will have corrected the situation in a way that gives you satisfaction, and the place will be better off.

Hermes Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Prominent MUSA Citizen Joined: May 19 2009 Location: Middletown Status: Offline Points: 1637	Post Options Post Reply Quote Hermes Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: Jun 22 2009 at 7:05am
	It's nice of the city to have a policy of approving everything you do EXCEPT spend money or at least THEIR money. What a pathetic bunch.
	No more democrats no more republicans,vote Constitution Party !!

Mike_Presta Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List MUSA Council Joined: Apr 20 2008 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 3483	Post Options Post Reply Quote Mike_Presta Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: Jun 22 2009 at 7:30am
	Better yet, tell Moving Middletown Forward or Middletown Pride in Action or whatever they are calling themselves today about YOUR plan to do it with YOUR money and YOUR labor and City Hall will be tickled pink not only to "approve" it but to let Sam and Ann take credit for it!
	“Mulligan said he ... doesn’t believe they necessarily make the return on investment necessary to keep funding them.” …The Middletown Journal, January 30, 2012

Vivian Moon Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List MUSA Council Joined: May 16 2008 Location: Middletown, Ohi Status: Offline Points: 4187	Post Options Post Reply Quote Vivian Moon Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: Jun 22 2009 at 7:45am
	Mike Now that really sounds like a great Pride in Action Plan. I will sit by my phone all day today and not mow my grass and wait for their phone call.

spiderjohn Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Prominent MUSA Citizen Joined: Jul 01 2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 2749	Post Options Post Reply Quote spiderjohn Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: Jun 22 2009 at 8:10am
	Fellow Amerikans/Middletownians---we have entered a new age globally,nationally and locally. Forget yer politicians,admins,boards,committees,movers/shakers whatever. If you have issues--take care of them if you can. We are on our own--the sooner you accept that, the better off you will be. Fix/clean up yer properties and neighborhoods. When you are out in public, don't throw trash anywhere. Conversely--pick up trash of others and dispose of it properly. Fix anything that you can fix. Help anyone that you can help in any way possible. Carry this approach to govt.meetings--positively,politely though firmly and constructively. Accept nothing less from your public officials/employess however don't get discouraged when they don't follow the lead or disappoint. They will either come around eventually(quickly) or we simply replace them(quietly and politely) We have an up-coming Conversation with Council on 6/30 I believe There may be a renegade attempt from a loose cannon on the charter review committee to dominate this meeting by having members explain EACH OF 12 articles recommended for approval of Council to be placed on the Nov.ballot. So--be prepared to ? those topics and to quickly dismiss many of them as un-important or un-favorable. Then steer this "conversation" in whatever direction the citizens might choose. Opportunities to publicly address Council are now few and far between(plus being covered by TVM(the citizen-funded public TV network). Really--it is YOUR meeting opportunity. Come organized and prepared. Please be pointed,BRIEF,and considerate of all points of view and individuals. We can go a long way towards unification--let's don't blow it from our end. If the Council/Amin or any idividual wants to control/dominate--stand fim and don't allow. jmo

Paul Nagy Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List MUSA Citizen Joined: Jan 11 2009 Status: Offline Points: 384	Post Options Post Reply Quote Paul Nagy Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: Jun 22 2009 at 8:16am
	Vivian Moon, Now that you have vented your anger and made plenty of personal innuendos about me, do you feel better? Have you gotten closer or further away from what needs to be done in the cemetary? I was there when you refused the $22,000 and issued your ultimatum. My point is WE have not gotten anywhere with this approach and there must be another way. Just because WE don't bow down to your every whim doesn't mean We don't care as much as you do. Just because you don't see what other people do doesn't mean others aren't doing something in their own way. Spider, WE can file my opinions right along with your many opinions that talked about using common sense and negotiating through the last ten years. If your memory fails you on this point go back and look at all of your blogs in support of Ann Mort, Sam Ashworth, etc. I suggest We take another approach in the same spirit you always did when you were telling us to get things done in a constructive way. Again, these blogs make my point that its easier to make personal attacks than to come up with a solution. If the city isn't going to accept its responsiblity (and it hasn't so far) what then? We all agree on the city's irresponsibilities. Now, how do WE get the job done. Please give an answer other than threatening lawsuits and name calling. Thank you. Paul Nagy

Paul Nagy Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List MUSA Citizen Joined: Jan 11 2009 Status: Offline Points: 384	Post Options Post Reply Quote Paul Nagy Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: Jun 22 2009 at 8:20am
	Spider, I agree with every word that you have just blogged about the Jone 30th meeting. Paul nagy

Pacman Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Prominent MUSA Citizen Joined: Jun 02 2007 Status: Offline Points: 2612	Post Options Post Reply Quote Pacman Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: Jun 22 2009 at 8:56am
	I thought the July 7th Council Meetign was basicaly going to be the meetign to discuss The Charter review Boards recommendations.

spiderjohn Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Prominent MUSA Citizen Joined: Jul 01 2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 2749	Post Options Post Reply Quote spiderjohn Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: Jun 22 2009 at 9:22am
	Mr.Nagy--when I mention "everyone else", Spider is most definitely included. I STILL support Ms.Mort/Mr.Ashworth in their PRIDE approach, and am very appreciative of their efforts regarding many situations. Do I agree AND SUPPORT every project they champion? ABSOLUTELY NOT! I like them both personally both on and off "the clock". Name calling--very little and none in a long while from my end. Confronting Council/admin--note my extended absence from comment forums other than the internet(here). Sorry to ruffle yer feathers, Mr.N I am simply my own person representing my own thinking. I am not a great team player, and prefer to stand on my own Be assured that I will not disappear in Sept., Oct. and November. As a charter review committee member, will you enlighten us on just what hast transpired since the recommendations have been brought forward and presented to Council?

Vivian Moon Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List MUSA Council Joined: May 16 2008 Location: Middletown, Ohi Status: Offline Points: 4187	Post Options Post Reply Quote Vivian Moon Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: Jun 22 2009 at 9:22am
	Vivian Moon, Now that you have vented your anger and made plenty of personal innuendos about me, do you feel better? Mr. Nagy, I don't need to vent any anger. I have made no personal innuedos about you. I simply stated that you do not know all the facts about this situation that has been going on for the past six years. Have you gotten closer or further away from what needs to be done in the cemetary? Mr. Nagy, I believe we are much closer to solving the problems of the Middletown Cemetery. I was there when you refused the $22,000 and issued your ultimatum. Mr. Nagy, you are wrong again on both counts...I already had the $11,000 grant and I had already issued the ultimaium 5 years ago. Mr. Nagy, the Middletown Cemetery Committee and the families of those buried at the Middletown Cemetery did refused the $11,000 one time payment from the City. My point is WE have not gotten anywhere with this approach and there must be another way. Just because WE don't bow down to your every whim doesn't mean We don't care as much as you do. Just because you don't see what other people do doesn't mean others aren't doing something in their own way. Mr. Nagy, The Middletown Cemetery Commitee and the Families have a perfect right to file a legal action against the City. I have not request that you bow down to anything in anyway. We have requested that the City care for and maintain the Middletown Cemetery and account for the missing funds. If it takes legal action to make them step up to the plate so be it. Spider, WE can file my opinions right along with your many opinions that talked about using common sense and negotiating through the last ten years. If your memory fails you on this point go back and look at all of your blogs in support of Ann Mort, Sam Ashworth, etc. I suggest We take another approach in the same spirit you always did when you were telling us to get things done in a constructive way. Mr. Nagy, what do you do when the constructive common sense way doesn't work and the building can't wait for the City to take action? Again, these blogs make my point that its easier to make personal attacks than to come up with a solution. If the city isn't going to accept its responsiblity (and it hasn't so far) what then? Mr. Nagy, I presented the problem, the solution and even the money and labor..NEXT! We all agree on the city's irresponsibilities. Now, how do WE get the job done. Mr. Nagy, WE have been working on getting the job done. Now WE have now taken legal action to solve the rest of this very problem. Please give an answer other than threatening lawsuits and name calling. Thank you. Paul Nagy

Paul Nagy Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List MUSA Citizen Joined: Jan 11 2009 Status: Offline Points: 384	Post Options Post Reply Quote Paul Nagy Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: Jun 22 2009 at 10:07am
	I was there when you refused the $22,000 and issued your ultimatum". Mr. Nagy, you are wrong again on both counts...I already had the $11,000 grant and I had already issued the ultimaium 5 years ago. Yes, you had the $11,00 grant but you did not have the city's $11,000 until Ms. Gilliland offered it that morning. She also said she would try to find more in the future when I asked her. Yes, $22,000 is a lot of money when its the taxpayers money and yes I worry a lot when the city wants to spend $500,000 on a bike path at this time in our economy and I'm addressing the problem with them. By your own admission , "I had already issued the ultimatum 5 years ago". Well, issuing the ultimatum hasn't done any of us any good for five years so far. Ladies and Gentleman, I submit my final conclusion of the matter is: In her opinion Vivian Moon says its her way or the highway. I don't think it will get very far with the city or a law suit. Lets get it done another way. Fini. Paul Nagy

Vivian Moon Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List MUSA Council Joined: May 16 2008 Location: Middletown, Ohi Status: Offline Points: 4187	Post Options Post Reply Quote Vivian Moon Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: Jun 22 2009 at 10:27am
	By your own admission , "I had already issued the ultimatum 5 years ago". Well, issuing the ultimatum hasn't done any of us any good for five years so far. Mr. Nagy, again you are wrong. Nothing and I do mean nothing, had been done at the cemetery for years, it was an overgrown weed patch until I issued the ultimatum 5 years ago. In her opinion Vivian Moon says its her way or the highway. No Mr. Nagy...the LAW states it should be OUR way.