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VietVet View Drop Down
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    Posted: Jun 03 2008 at 7:35am
Middletown Journal- story- June 3-Why does Middletown have more Section 8 housing than all of Butler County? Is there some advantage for the city to want to embrace this program? How does the city benefit from this abundance of government assisted living? Doesn't this program help drive down any positive image for the city? Why do we want to be known as the Section 8 capital of Southwest Ohio? IMO, we need to reduce this housing and phase it out over time. I noticed, by the story, that Marconi had a role in this type of housing at one time. This is one more thing that is helping drive down Middletown's image/reputation with the surrounding cities. This makes the city poorer and makes a negative impact on the city.
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VietVet, you are exactly correct.  There is no reason for Middletown to have 1660+ of the approximately 2660 section 8 vouchers.  It is ridicules that city leaders let this happen once again years ago.  Let the county have them and be done with this drain on the city.  As far as Marconi owning section 8 housing, if he still owns even one house that is classified section 8 or plans to own one in the near future he should step aside on this vote and conversation and abstain.
 
 
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When will this madness come to an end? Two weeks ago I witnessed an
altercation in front of the new section 8 apartments on Bonita. There were
about 20 kids aged 10-14 out on the street at midnight and a brawl
nearly erupted. There were two groups screaming and shouting threats
at each other. Not one parent in sight either.  They ran away before the police got there but I have a feeling this is going to be a long summer.
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.308 View Drop Down
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I think larger cities have already learned the lesson that subsidized housing has the least impact on communities when it is highly decentralized. Is it too much to ask that the same logic be used on a county scale?
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Some action may be done soon about the unproportionate amount of Section 8 housing in Middletown compared to other cities. Middletown Journal reported on it yesterday.
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The article I saw in the Sunday Journal stated that the talk is about who will take over the Section 8 housing for Middletown (or do they still want to control it locally.) Gilleland said this is about administering the program, not about reducing the Section 8 housing in Middletown. It's a shame because as they discuss who will run the program they could also be discussing reducing Section 8 housing.Midd. doesn't need an abundance of this housing. It runs the city down even further.Once again, they are making wrong decisions for the city.When will they learn how to make competent decisions?
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I understand that it is about the Administration, but under the current system if you are given a Section 8 voucher from Middletown you must live in Middletown.  If the County takes it over then you can live anywhere in the County.  This is how I understood the process.
 
In otherwords you were forced to basically live, work if you don't have a car and send your children to Middletown schools under the current system.
 
If the County takes over the Administration you would no longer have this restriction and hopefully this will eventually reduce the number of Vouchers in Middletown, and also the section 8 housing.
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Hope you're right on this. What ever it takes to reduce the amount of Section 8 in Middletown, I'm all for it. To rid ourselves of this would be a small victory for the town towards turning around the badly damaged image that we have now. Having a reputation as a poor, disfuntional, welfare city with major Section 8 housing is a crushing blow to this city. You can't market new people or businessess with that label tied around your neck.
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Ernie View Drop Down
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Your right...heaven forbid...I wont stereotype people either...Im better than that...to hell with the poor. Let them live in a box under the bridge somewhere out of sight. I cant have my good name rubbed in the mud. What will my neighbors think of me? Youre the one that needs the help. So...go ahead and hate your neighbor, go ahead and cheat your friend, do it in the name of heaven, it will all be justified in the end. Youre the kind of people this town doesnt need.
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"Forgive me if I am not justified in what I ask," said Scrooge, looking intently at the Spirit's robe, "but I see something strange, and not belonging to yourself, protruding from your skirts. Is it a foot or a claw?"

"It might be a claw, for the flesh there is upon it," was the Spirit's sorrowful reply. "Look here."

From the foldings of its robe, it brought two children; wretched, abject, frightful, hideous, miserable. They knelt down at its feet, and clung upon the outside of its garment.

"Oh, Man, look here! Look, look, down here!" exclaimed the Ghost.

They were a boy and a girl. Yellow, meagre, ragged, scowling, wolfish; but prostrate, too, in their humility. Where graceful youth should have filled their features out, and touched them with its freshest tints, a stale and shrivelled hand, like that of age, had pinched, and twisted them, and pulled them into shreds. Where angels might have sat enthroned, devils lurked, and glared out menacing. No change, no degradation, no perversion of humanity, in any grade, through all the mysteries of wonderful creation, has monsters half so horrible and dread.

Scrooge started back, appalled. Having them shown to him in this way, he tried to say they were fine children, but the words choked themselves, rather than be parties to a lie of such enormous magnitude.

"Spirit, are they yours?" Scrooge could say no more.

"They are Man's," said the Spirit, looking down upon them. "And they cling to me, appealing from their fathers. This boy is Ignorance. This girl is Want. Beware them both, and all of their degree, but most of all beware this boy, for on his brow I see that written which is Doom, unless the writing be erased. Deny it!" cried the Spirit, stretching out its hand towards the city. "Slander those who tell it ye. Admit it for your factious purposes, and make it worse. And abide the end."

"Have they no refuge or resource?" cried Scrooge.

"Are there no prisons?" said the Spirit, turning on him for the last time with his own words. "Are there no workhouses?"

The bell struck twelve.
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So Ernie and .308 you are perfectly content with 56% of the section 8 housing in the county being in Middletown or even more, eventhough Middletown only represents 15% of the counties population?  I see nothing wrong with cutting the section 8 vouchers and housing in Middletown to a reasonable level to match its population.  Let some of the other cities have some of this over flow.
 
By the way where do you all live?
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http://www.ci.middletown.oh.us/docs/council/4262007_m.pdf
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Pacman- I happen to own my home in Middletown and have managed very successfully in Middletown for 30 +years and have never found myself or my family in need of a place to lay our heads or drawn a dime of welfare or any other government benefits.

That doesn't mean I don't know there are people who work every day and BECAUSE of the lack of decent paying jobs with good benefits, finding a home isn't always so easy.What I don't understand is the assumption that all of the people on section 8 are welfare bums and that somehow they are they ones responsible for the situation Middletown is currently going through. So, considering the amount of respectable jobs that have been lost in this city, there lies the rub.
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Ernie-IN GENERAL- I have no problem with the Section 8 people who pay their bills, see that their kids are educated, take care of their affairs and do what we do on a daily basis. I do have a problem with the Section 8 people who sponge off the public. With Section 8 people who are constantly in trouble with the law. With Section 8 people who have another kid even though they can't take care of the five they have and I have the biggest problem with my (our) taxpayer money helping these people for medical, food stamps and other freebies, who have demonstrated that they are perfectly willing to live forever off of your (my) work efforts/taxes.It's called TAKING RESPONSIBILITY FOR YOUR DECISIONS/ ACTIONS in life. I am GENERALIZING here, and yes, I can't make my point without a certain amount of stereotyping.Of course there are people who are NOT Section 8 candidates that do these same things.Right or wrong, Section 8 is viewed by the public as a negative as to the image of a city.When you add an overabundance of Section 8, it magnifies the image problem. Middletown doesn't need any more image problems. The real discussion here is not about the Section 8 people. It is about why Council allowed an overabundance of Section 8 housing into town.Why does Middletown want most of the Section 8 housing in Butler County and what advantage/positive does it bring to the city? At this time, I can see no advantage for the city.
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"Pacman- I happen to own my home in Middletown and have managed very successfully in Middletown for 30 +years and have never found myself or my family in need of a place to lay our heads or drawn a dime of welfare or any other government benefits."

Ernie I fail to see what the above statement has to to with this conversation.  No one insinuated you were on Government Assistance, the only question was where do you live.
 
Ernie explain to us why Middletown should shoulder the bulk of the Section 8 Housing in Butler County?
 
Is not section 8 housing a drain on City Resources?  I can tell you from being a Police Officer many years ago it is.
 
Ernie what is wrong with re-adjusting the number of Section 8 housing units in Middletown to be more inline with its population in the County?
 
Would not giving the Admin of this program benefit the Counties disadvantaged as a whole, allowing Section 8 receipiants to live anywhere in the County?
 
Why must Middletown with its financial burdens, Image Problems and decline in Tax revenues continue to be thought of as the Section 8 Capital of Butler County?
 
No one is talking about doing away with the program, although at the Council meeting it was noted that Middletown could simply just dump all Section 8 vouchers and be out of the Section 8 program altogether, but no one is suggesting that.
 
Please enlighten us as to Why you feel we need so much Section 8 Housing and Vouchers compared to the rest of the county.  The other Cities in Butler County do not have a Section 8 Program it is administered by  Butler County.  Only 2 cities in Ohio have a Section 8 program and Middletown is one of them, unfortunately.
 
 
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I was just pointing out the human side of this issue that is much the same today as it was in 1843 when that sad scene by Dickens was first published.

Our future as a society still hinges on our ability to balance our compassion for those less fortunate with the need to not overburden those of means who from necessity tend to shoulder the greatest financial responsibility of such efforts.

Yet as I mentioned earlier I see no reason any single area, or in our case city, should host a higher concentration of section 8 units than the surrounding communities.
 
I live in Middletown. Also for 30 plus years.
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I agree, perhaps I have too much compassion for humanity. It sure wasnt acquired from where I retired. I wish I knew of a way to find who owns each piece of section 8 housing. There is more to this abundance of section 8 housing than we know of.  I would be willing to say that the findings would be interesting.

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Ernie this is not about compassion for your fellow man.  It is about spreading the expense of that compassion around to the rest of the cities, townships, etc. in Butler County.  No one city or locality should have to bear far more than its fair share as Middletown does.  I fail to understand why City Council is having such a hard time with this decision.
 
Lets try getting some compassion and financial relief from:
 
Alert
Astoria
Auburn
Avalon
Beckett Ridge
Bethany
Blue Ball
Bunker Hill
Busenbark
City View Heights
Collinsville
Contreras
Darrtown
Eldorado
Excello
Fairfield
Fairplay
Gano
Hamilton
 Harlan Park
Hughes
Huntsville
Indian Springs
Jacksonburg
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This is unfortunate:

"Middletown has 15% of Butler Countys population; 23% of the Countys residents in poverty; 38% of the Countys subsidized housing units (that percentage does not include Section 8 housing units); 56% of the Countys Section 8 voucher holders; and 40% of the Countys Housing for the mentally ill.  Overall, about 35% of Middletowns occupied rental housing is designated for low income."

Why would the City allow this to happen?  You do not need a Phd. to see that something is wrong here.  Is the almighty $$$ at work here?
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Ernie and Pacman:
 
You are both right to certain degrees. And there is much overlap in your beliefs. Perhaps you should concentrate on the real issue, how do we correct our poverty rate since it is the highest in the county.
John Beagle

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News of, for and by the people of Middletown, Ohio.
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Pacman,
 
That one bit of info you just listed, that is of course taken from your above link, is all anyone should need to know to see there is something not right here.
 
Like most of the comments so far, nothing against those in section 8 housing, but that data sure makes it look like Middletown is trying to corner the market.
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arwendt states, ".....but that data sure makes it look like Middletown is trying to corner the market."
 
Exactly, the question is why and who is benefiting from this, it sure isn't the average citizen of Middletown.
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Your right John...we can cry and complain all day long and where does it get us. I need to be the hammer not the nail. Let me see if I can find some facts to support what I want to say that should be a little more helpful.
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No crying and complaining here.  I stated the cities own facts and the bottomline Section 8 Housing and Vouchers need to be reduced in Middletown and spread more throughout the county.
 
I also think the first step in that process is to move control out of Middletown and let Butler County handle it.  Then you begin to reduced the number of available section 8 units in Middletown.
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A few observations on the City Council meeting and Section 8 housing.

1) It was obvious that CONSOC Housing Consultants of Columbus and the Citizens currently on Section 8 are passionate about its administration remaining in Middletown. I also think it is obvious that many residents of Middletown and business owners failed to voice their opinions in the Public Comment Section due to the fear of being harassed for their opinion. Look at what happened the last time an issue such as this was raised and I refer to the Senior Housing issue that came up a year or so ago. Business owners and residents voiced their opinions and many were derided for those opinions.

2) Currently Middletown maintains an excessive number of Butler Counties Section 8 Vouchers, approximately 1660 vouchers or 56% of the Counties vouchers for a population that only represents 15% of the County. This number needs to be brought more inline with the Cities population in the county. In others words the number needs to be reduced.

A Plan to reduce the amount of Section 8 housing in Middletown:

1) A moratorium on any additional Section 8 housing in Middletown.

2) Turn over the current vouchers to BMH for administration with the following provisions.

a) All current Section 8 Vouchers recipients in Middletown maintain their current status.

b) Due to the number of vouchers in Middletown a satellite BMH office should be opened and maintained in Middletown. This can be structured so that as the number of vouchers in Middletown is reduced the hours or number of days the Office is open can be reduced and eventually closed when the number of vouchers has reached a certain level, determined by council. This was a major concern of Section 8 recipients, having to drive to Hamilton. The other major concern was that they didn’t want to deal with BMH, we can’t always pick who we want to deal with in our lives and this is just a fact of life.

c) By transferring all vouchers and administration of the program to BMH, as Middletown’s recipients no longer need a voucher, the voucher would go to the next recipient on the list and they could live in any city in the county that has Section 8 housing available. This should theoretically reduce the number of vouchers in Middletown and also reduce the need to maintain so much section 8 housing in Middletown. The goal is to reduce Middletown’s Section 8 housing to be more inline with its population. Currently about 98% of the section 8 vouchers in Middletown go to residents of Middletown, in other words you live in Middletown you get preference over anyone else.

d) The City Council can maintain inspection control of the Section 8 units if that is desired. They should also require a seat on the BMH Housing Committee/Council. I disagree with the City Council and City Admin becoming more involved with this program. The City has enough issues to deal with which concern 51,000 residents, they do not need to have another committee or issue to deal with. Also Cities involvement with this program in the past is why we are at where we are currently. The City should also not be in the business of supporting the industry of Section 8 Landlords. The Councils objective should be the reduction of this type of housing and its use, for the overall improvement of the City. That should be their main GOAL, THE OVERALL IMPROVEMENT OF THE CITY AS A WHOLE. Turning this matter over to the professionals will benefit all involved, especially Middletown down the road. The City must become more aggressive and progressive in the handling of its issues. It must look at the overall picture for the improvement of the city as a whole not just one section or sector of the population.

This should be a priority for Council as this is not an instant fix and will take years, but it is a step in the right direction to improve the overall quality of life in Middletown, improve its standing in the community and to entice economic growth in the City, rather than to just be stagnant as we are now and continue with the Status Quo.
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