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Thursday, November 21, 2024 |
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Heroin Epidemic |
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Vivian Moon 
MUSA Council 
Joined: May 16 2008 Location: Middletown, Ohi Status: Offline Points: 4187 |
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 Posted: Feb 06 2015 at 12:42pm |
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Duncan Oil swap with other
properties cost little in funding, and to a large part was conceived when
Governor Strickland was in office and
Factguy…you’re kidding right? If not..then you really need to go back and look at the records for this entire group of purchases and demos. And look at what we got now to greet ya as you cross the tracks into downtown But the Duncan Oil deal came at the end of a flurry of deals on buildings in the downtown. Do you remember how City Hall ended up owning the Studio Theater? This City Hall plan started with the plan to demo the Studio Theater and the demo of the burned out Barb’s Pub on Then City Hall purchased the City Hall then decided they needed the building behind these buildings and that’s when City Hall purchased the And while all this mess was going on we had the NSP rehab give-away going on. |
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spiderjohn
Prominent MUSA Citizen 
Joined: Jul 01 2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 2749 |
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Posted: Feb 06 2015 at 2:27pm |
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thanx 4 the continued discussion, factguy--much appreciated!
though we disagree, we can do it cordially and factually. Duncan Oil--please correct me where wrong: The first attempt involved Duncan purchasing the former Office Outfiiter site for a proposed convenience store/service station center. Duncan primarily sells gasoline--they are not really in the business of operating retail centers. I know, because I was approached to possibly operate or purchase this site from them. I thanked them for the thought and declined. Nothing ever happened. Then the frenzy over the train station started, when we were all guaranteed that the location would be a stop between Cincy and Cleveland. Well---that concept disappeared when Ohio citizens came to their senses to vote out then Gov.Strickland and his spendaholic pie in the sky thinking. No surprise to anyone. As Mr.P stated---the train concept proved to be too slow and unrealistically expensive to serve the projected # of passengers. There were never any concrete plans for a Middletown layover. During that period, the city(or Duncan) acquired a small Finkleman parcel adjacent to the Duncan property(took too long and cost too much). I believe the city purchased the Duncan property for $300,000(I was offered it prior for much less) and the site of the former Clark station at the tracks. Duncan then purchased the strip center there between Central and 1st(with the city $$ proceeds from the OO sale). Then all properties were demoed(not sure who paid for ech parcel demo). Then the city borrowed from the sewer fund to purchase the former Office Outfitter site from the downtown fund?, where it has been reduced to it's current state. So--we have gone from all tax-producing properties with tax-paying businesses(+ tax-paying employees) to nothingness. Twice Duncan has failed to produce, and the community is out all expenses, including the high $$ Admin costs to "oversee/plan" all of this. True--we all elected those on Council, and all are good, credible people. That does not necessarily mean that the majority of citizens are happy with their decisions and the history of direction for Middletown. There were simply few other options. Like our recent tax levys, voters barely approved while holding their noses. Citizens have literally given up on our local govt. They no longer attend Council meetings or watch the meetings on TVM(what little is honestly discussed)--"emergency" legislation is used more now than ever to avoid public input on important issues that have no real reason to be emergencied. It is more of an obvious convenience. Section 8--poor roads--lack of shopping options--all brought on by past/current Commissions/Councils/Admins. MUSA postings had nothing to do with any of these dilemmas, though it has many much more aware of them. MUSA has become the Fox News of Middietown imo. More than willing to give Doug A a chance to turn it around reasonably, though he needs to show us REAL positive change quickly and consistently, by whatever means necessary. jmo |
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Factguy
MUSA Resident 
Joined: Dec 07 2009 Status: Offline Points: 217 |
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Posted: Feb 06 2015 at 3:27pm |
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Everyone must pull together to turn Middletown around, it cannot be done by a few people, city council, or the school board alone. Similarly, turning a manufacturing city is a time consuming process which requires patience. In response to the 54% poverty declaration by Doug Adkins, no one can dispute the income levels in Middletown have fallen, and moreover, the data used and given to HUD was based upon accurate records. It was not Mr. Adkins that created the 54%, rather, he used it to leverage the distribution of HUD funds to be used to benefit multiple areas within Middletown, not one area specifically. You aren't suggesting the water main lines are breaking in the cold weather because of sewer funds being moved to the general fund to buy downtown property?
Anyone can run for elected office, and those inclined should do so.
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spiderjohn
Prominent MUSA Citizen
Joined: Jul 01 2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 2749 |
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Posted: Feb 06 2015 at 3:54pm |
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lol--no connections with water lines breaking, though there are a lot of them doing just that this year(and it hasn't been THAT cold).
Correct Doug A did not create the poverty, and is trying to deal with it. The majority declaration allows the funding to be spent more broadly, though is it being spent that way? Hopefully more younger community leaders will step up next election cycle. We need them NOW! It might help if a lot of the current long-term power figures would fade away, and those currently serving might think twice about running again. We need change, but it has to be a positive progressive change. Community division and mental fences are stifling. Maybe some day(soon!), we can all be one team again? |
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Factguy
MUSA Resident
Joined: Dec 07 2009 Status: Offline Points: 217 |
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Posted: Feb 06 2015 at 4:52pm |
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We should all be positive about all the good things taking place in Middletown!
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over the hill
MUSA Citizen 
Joined: Oct 19 2012 Location: middletown Status: Offline Points: 952 |
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Posted: Feb 06 2015 at 5:12pm |
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As for the 54%, on the heels of the "dying city" declaration, why would any one want to use that tactic and that label for our city? Talk about distroying a city image with such a label, IMO that was dastardly deed done by D.A. evidently with the blessing of our city manager and our city council. Time has not proven that the move helped the most needy. It only served to give Middletown another black eye we didn't need. IMO
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Factguy
MUSA Resident
Joined: Dec 07 2009 Status: Offline Points: 217 |
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Posted: Feb 06 2015 at 6:00pm |
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You should be very pleased Doug Adkins and city council in a short period of time, reduced the poverty level by income, from 54% to 36%. Great job.
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Vivian Moon
MUSA Council
Joined: May 16 2008 Location: Middletown, Ohi Status: Offline Points: 4187 |
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Posted: Feb 06 2015 at 6:08pm |
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Over the Hill
At that meeting Mr. Adkins said "give me the power and I will make it happen." Well it happened all right. City Hall then started their fight with the land lords and HUD and Middletown was in the papers every month. They RE-BRANDED the city alright....but not in a positive light. They gained nothing in the end of all this money and time spent were wasted.. Now City Hall has several legal issues because of their actions and we get to pay the legal bills for another mess. |
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Factguy
MUSA Resident
Joined: Dec 07 2009 Status: Offline Points: 217 |
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Posted: Feb 06 2015 at 7:07pm |
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Are you suggesting the city had a positive brand 5 years ago, when the city 54% poverty, and had nearly 1700 vouchers?
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Vivian Moon
MUSA Council
Joined: May 16 2008 Location: Middletown, Ohi Status: Offline Points: 4187 |
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Posted: Feb 06 2015 at 7:31pm |
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You should be very pleased Doug Adkins and city council in a short period of time, reduced the poverty level by income, from 54% to 36%. Great job.
Show me the numbers to prove this statement. Are you suggesting the city had a positive brand 5 years ago, when the city 54% poverty, and had nearly 1700 vouchers? And the City of Middletown still has 1662 available vouchers that are now managed by Warren & Butler County, HUD. The poverty level will go back up as soon as all these vouchers become available again. |
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VietVet
MUSA Council
Joined: May 15 2008 Status: Offline Points: 7008 |
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Posted: Feb 06 2015 at 8:33pm |
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Factguy:
"Everyone must pull together to turn Middletown around, it cannot be done by a few people, city council, or the school board alone" But they don't want our help Factguy. And, their idea of helping them is to stay out the way if your views don't match theirs. You can't get this "team concept" where everybody joins together to help change things if the team is dysfunctional and 180 degrees in opinion as to the direction of the city. Oil and water don't mix and I would suspect it would be that way if "everyone pulled together". Some people just won't drink the water around here as they know it is bad for their health. Factguy: "It was not Mr. Adkins that created the 54%" He may not have created the 54% but he certainly condoned it under the Gilleland administration. He went along with the program without offering any dissention. That makes him an accessory to the current problems. Factguy: "You aren't suggesting the water main lines are breaking in the cold weather because of sewer funds being moved to the general fund to buy downtown property?" Well, let's see. Water mains break over time due to age, neglect and a lack of a preventative maintenance program. The roads and infrastructure money fund was used for other purposes in the 80's and never replaced. Because these funds were absent from the budget for so long, and the city was responsible for renewing the funding for the streets and sewers but failed to do so, yes, I would say that due to a lack of funding, the water main break frequency is due to money nonavailability. It is a practice with this city to move monies to the general fund to launder and disperse to special agenda projects. It is a method of concealment used by Carrolus and others to play the old hand motion pee under the peanut shell game so that the public can't follow the money flow easily. Been used for years here. Factguy: "Anyone can run for elected office, and those inclined should do so" Ahh, but can they win against the power block set in motion for the MMF sponsored candidates? That's the real question. History tells us no. Awfully hard to defeat an established, money-rich little network that is firmly entrenched in this city. Most don't have the ability to match financing, networking nor time to match the MMF. |
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I'm so proud of my hometown and what it has become. Recall 'em all. Let's start over.
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wannaknow
MUSA Resident
Joined: Feb 21 2009 Status: Offline Points: 138 |
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Posted: Feb 08 2015 at 7:24am |
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This thread started out as the heroin epidemic. As I said in an earlier post I lost a daughter to drugs. Needless to say I have zero tolerance for any type of drug. This may sound a little hypocritical since I have owned and operated a bar I inherited from my husband's death in 2007.
I attended numerous NA meetings with my daughter and they all ended with the serenity prayer and the phrase "remember alcohol is a drug". I wrestled with this personal moral issue almost daily for the past 10 years. The heroin epidemic affected my business in a two-fold way. One, my zero tolerance would not allow drug dealers/users to frequent my bar. I called them out on it and made some enemies. On a not so personal note, most heroin addicts don't drink a lot anyway. I closed business on December 30th, 2014. I have followed Middletownusa for several years. I've seen the town continue to spiral downhill. Everyone agrees we need change but it hasn't happened. I had big hopes with Josh, Gary Barge and my hero Bob Presta. The problem is the majority of people that vote are friends of the ones we want to get rid of or the ones in office run unopposed. I have an idea. Why don't we get together and plan an organized strategy to find replacements and then make a concentrated effort to spark people's interest enough to go to the polls. I know it's possible. I have a meeting place and lots of coffee. |
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VietVet
MUSA Council
Joined: May 15 2008 Status: Offline Points: 7008 |
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Posted: Feb 08 2015 at 9:20am |
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Getting together to establish a game plan is a great idea wanna. Problem is, it has been tried in the past with poor success. Can't get anyone to show. In past meetings, the same 8-10 people showed each Sunday at the Library. Even had Councilpersons Marconi and Scott-Jones show up one time. Never went any further than that though. Apathy is your enemy. People are mad, but not mad enough to do anything pro-active to let city hall know.
And the city leaders are banking that it stays that way. As long as there is apathy, they keep getting their way with absolutely no resistance. |
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I'm so proud of my hometown and what it has become. Recall 'em all. Let's start over.
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Factguy
MUSA Resident
Joined: Dec 07 2009 Status: Offline Points: 217 |
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Posted: Feb 08 2015 at 12:57pm |
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It takes much more to become organized and define a purpose than to follow the path of anger. Without organization, purpose, structure, discipline, and an objective, nothing can be accomplished. Of greater importance, is intelligence, credibility, and an ability to communicate. If there is no credibility, others have no desire to be associated with an individual nor group, Without a message and ability to communicate effectively, you create confusion. Without purpose, there is no desire to achieve, to overcome, to change, to succeed. Without an ability to define the audience and who votes in elections, you are wasting your time. The reason we win is you have never found nor maintained anything but anger associated with minority status. Knowledge is power. Power is control. Control is guidance. Guidance is leadership.
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VietVet
MUSA Council
Joined: May 15 2008 Status: Offline Points: 7008 |
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Posted: Feb 08 2015 at 5:13pm |
Sounds like the city motto Factguy (Kohler perhaps?) So when is the city going to start working on these things that you mention? I don't see the city leaders having organization, purpose, structure discipline nor an objective that benefits the city or it's residents.....with the exception of a few inner circle people. Factguy: "The reason we win"........so it is true. The city has the same agenda as some of us here......a them against us mentality. And just how do you think that started Factguy? Probably when the city leaders started to ignore the general populace and design an agenda that caters to the chosen few, right? You got just what you wanted. A divided, angry, dis-functional community that will never see eye to eye. If you are Kohler, no wonder Lebanon didn't want you around. Oh, and there is no leadership of any worth in this city. |
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I'm so proud of my hometown and what it has become. Recall 'em all. Let's start over.
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spiderjohn
Prominent MUSA Citizen
Joined: Jul 01 2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 2749 |
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Posted: Feb 08 2015 at 8:03pm |
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very concerning, factguy....
no sure exactly what our officials and admin have actually "won" other than keeping the good ole boy crony system alive through the election process. Anyone who watched the meeting where the ward system was eliminated had to lose faith completely with the process protocol. The petition brought to Council proved to be insufficient clearly. What followed was an incredible miscarriage of city govt. Despite not having a valid petition, Council rammed the change through anyway, when one member(finishing his last term) changed his vote. After leaving Council, that member was hired by the city to an admin position for just long enough to qualify for his full public service pension despite being fired from a similar position within the county. Hmmm.... Prior, we had the coup where the mayor was removed by a motion from another councilmember(with complete support/urging from the city manager--a neutral(?) position). The councilmember making that motion also received a plum position after leaving Council. To say that this long-term group has governed well, and represented the entire community is very ?able. Granted--we usually get what we deserve, and we must be pretty sorry to deserve what we have received imo. I hope new faces emerge quickly to take us forward. It is clear that our future = our past with the same old same old. I hope that Mr.A pulls this off and cleans house. |
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Paul Nagy
MUSA Citizen
Joined: Jan 11 2009 Status: Offline Points: 384 |
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Posted: Feb 09 2015 at 4:11am |
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FactGuy writes: “It takes much more to become organized and define a purpose than to follow the path of anger. Without organization, purpose, structure, discipline, and an objective, nothing can be accomplished. Of greater importance, is intelligence, credibility, and an ability to communicate. If there is no credibility, others have no desire to be associated with an individual nor group, Without a message and ability to communicate effectively, you create confusion. Without purpose, there is no desire to achieve, to overcome, to change, to succeed. Without an ability to define the audience and who votes in elections, you are wasting your time. The reason we win is you have never found nor maintained anything but anger associated with minority status. Knowledge is power. Power is control. Control is guidance. Guidance is leadership. “ Factguy you are loose with the facts and distort facts as it is convenient for you to do so in avoiding all of the things that are said to you by all of those who have responded to you in this forum. Here are some facts for you: Elections have been won in Middletown because those who have been in power have increased bureaucracy and intimidate them if they don’t vote the way they are told. You have MMF that is an illegal political action committee and has worked to manipulate elections. You have firemen (an estimated 80% of whom live out of the city) putting on their identifying shirts and going door to door at election time with a biased message to vote for the cities agenda instead of working just to get out the vote. They do so to guarantee their paychecks and pensions. This provides the city with an enormous, unfair (and probably illegal) voting machine that otherwise couldn’t be afforded even by the city. The Seniors are intimidated by the threat of lack of funding if they don’t vote the cities agenda. The school Board also follows the pattern to vote the city agenda and get school employees to vote their salaries instead of what is right and good and fair for the citizens of the city. Nepotism also has assured votes. Look at our police department. This is where the votes come from to win the elections. Elections in Middletown are not won by candidates honestly. This is the audience the city has defined to win elections. Because Middletown has been without organization, purpose, structure, discipline, and an objective, nothing in Middletown has been accomplished of significance to turn the city around. There has been no intelligence, credibility, and ability to communicate. Thus, If there is no credibility, others have no desire to be associated with the city and without a message and ability to communicate effectively, you have created confusion. This is probably the underlying cause of citizen apathy. You state, “Knowledge is power. Power is control. Control is guidance. Guidance is leadership.” Well, power and control have been the main elements in Middletown city government for a long time. Yet, the city has not turned around or prospered. Why is that? It is because the power and control has been misused and abused for personal interests and pet projects and not for the betterment of the entire city. The city has no clear vision or plan for its future. The 20 year plan is nebulous at best and so are the other plans including Adkins current plan which city council has failed to share with its citizenry. But then they always act in secrecy and transparency is not one of their practices. The city needs a clear plan for its future. It must quit being so short sighted and must enlarge the vision for the future. Downtown is not enough! It needs a plan with the specific purpose of turning the city around. The plan must be specific, with a clear time line of accomplishment, specific steps for financing it and an emphasis on public safety, infrastructure and economic development. Providing jobs and transparency in our finances must be paramount. As a beginning point I offer the following for consideration: President Obama has designated 8.1 Billion dollars to return manufacturing back to the United States. Our great Governor John Kasich has designated 800 million dollars for manufacturing for the State of Ohio. We can get those in the fields of Education, health, technology, lite/clean manufacturing to come here. We need to enlarge our vision and stop the petty, stinking thinking. It looks like our Chamber of Commerce has got a new, active, positive and practical approach to our business needs and we should use them and encourage them to continue on. There are some things right about Middletown but not due to our present administration. If nothing else, we can imitate what West Chester, Mason, Monroe, Springboro, Hamilton and Fairfield are doing. This city belongs to all of its taxpaying citizens and not just to the few who are self serving. We need public servants who are interested in serving others. The voices on this forum have a clear understanding of where we are and where we need to go. We should be thankful for their commitment and continued concerns. Paul Nagy
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