Third grade reading guarantee

She is probably afraid that teachers might actually have to do their job.

Vet: just to be accurate, teachers contribute much more to their retirement than workers who are under social security.  They are required to pay 9% instead of 4.2% (2012).  The military seems to have a "comfy" retirement when it allows one to get "twenty years and out."  Teachers are not "paid 3 months off during the year." They may have their pay spread out over 12 months, but it is for work performed during the school year, August through May or June. "Negotiating raises three years into the future without actually having done the work as yet": isn't this what all unions do in the private sector?  I believe AK employees always have a contract two or three years in advance with raises approved in advance.  JMO. For the record, I am not a teacher, and I don't work for a school system.  chmoore 

chmoore1 wrote: Vet: just to be accurate, teachers contribute much more to their retirement than workers who are under social security.  They are required to pay 9% instead of 4.2% (2012).  The military seems to have a "comfy" retirement when it allows one to get "twenty years and out."  Teachers are not "paid 3 months off during the year." They may have their pay spread out over 12 months, but it is for work performed during the school year, August through May or June. "Negotiating raises three years into the future without actually having done the work as yet": isn't this what all unions do in the private sector?  I believe AK employees always have a contract two or three years in advance with raises approved in advance.  JMO. For the record, I am not a teacher, and I don't work for a school system.  chmoore

9%? Is that all? Private sector people have been contributing 5-10 and 15% for years. But that is not what bother me the most about public sector union jobs. The real rub is health care, dental, and vision contributions for public sector workers. They are not paying near 15% out of paycheck to conribute to their benefits package. Private sector employers have asked the employees for years now to contribute that and more. THAT's THE RUB WITH ME. What the public sector isn't made to contribute toward their bennies, the taxpayer from the private sector must make up the difference. Why, when the wages between public and private sectors are basically proportional? They ought to pay their fair share chmoore1.

I have two teachers that live "next door" to me. I have seen them enjoying their summers now for 6 years when the rest of us working stiffs get in the frikkin' car at 5AM and go the work....year around, not 3 months off. Yes, chmoore1, they get the dam summer off. They aren't teaching. School is not in session. There is no reason for them to show up at school. "Spread out over 12 months"? What the? You can spin it any way you want but the bottom line is they are paid a nice salary equivalent to a full year and they show up for work for 9 months. That's a fact. How would you substantiate the summer months of inactivity? What are they doing to make you think they are "working"?

As to your comment "Negotiating raises three years into the future without actually having done the work as yet": isn't this what all unions do in the private sector?

True....but I'm not a fan of private unions either. Just as bad as public unions. No difference. Same game played. Never worked for a union shop in 44 years. Do know that their world is light years away from non-union shops. Don't like it that union shops get a pay raise in
"years to come" without doing the work first. Perfect opportunity to squelch productivity. Money is already there no matter what kind of job they do. No, the merit system is what they need based on the assessement of what they DID CONTRIBUTE LAST YEAR. They don't want that. Holds them accountable for their performance and bursts their little pampered world.

"I believe AK employees always have a contract two or three years in advance with raises approved in advance"

And, we've all seen where AK has gone in relation to previous years, haven't we? Legacy costs? Benefit costs squeezing the company with continual demands from union folks. Is it really the best system for employer/worker progression and company stability?

Yes, so does GM, Ford and Chrysler but stories are told where they sleep half a shift, goof off, live well above the non-union ranks (and some in high rent neighborhoods with all their toys in the driveway). and have their screwoffs protected by the unions from getting fired. Just stories of course. Don't know if they are valid.

Vet: the current rate for social security "contributions" BY LAW is 4.2% up to $110,100 earned income.  If someone is paying more than that, something is amiss.  15%??? You can't just throw these unfounded figures out there to bolster your argument.  Next: not paying near 15% for medical insurance? I watched Middletown's renegotiations with their teachers last year. "Frozen" wages, 1% reduction this year, 1% reduction next year.  Board payment for health insurance is approximately $1,000/mo. Employee premium is approximately $150.00/month.  Seems like 15% to me ($1,000 x 15% is $150.00). Next, equal pay to corporate world? Bachelor's degree gets you $32-34,000/year.  MUST work toward master's degree, $300/credit hour x 48 hours = $14,400, bumps pay a little over $1,000/yr.  Private sector for bachelor's degree, at least upper 30's to low 40's.  Next: summer off.  Senario one:  teacher can get paid during school year only; from August through some part of June.  OR, they can take DEFFERED payment to be paid the same annual salary, but for 12 REDUCED pays, rather than 9 regular pays.   "Spin it any way you like, etc." they get paid for what they work!  This really is a useless point to argue, which I know that you understand.  Finally, of course you know the stories about goof-offs in factories---you've been around factory workers and have heard all the stories.  Is your battle with unions or that some people have a better life than you?  You work at Wright-Pat for a contractor.  Is the contractor union?  Perhaps that's the rub for you.     chmoore

Vet: thank you for the enjoyable reply! I think that we agree on more than the surface indicates.  Here is something that you might have missed in your other post about the combined Business Manager:  Middletown's recent BM earned about $85,000 if I remember correctly from last spring's list of public salaries.  Monroe's probably made about the same---I don't remember---plus he had HR responsibilities. Middletown now has food service, custodial/maintenance and transportation contracted out.  Monroe has transportation, custodial/maintenance, and---possibly---food service (but I may be wrong about that one).  HR will be done by Dr. Lolli according to one article.  Each district will pay 1/2 of his $107,500!!!! salary. Mr. Long made 99,000 at Springboro, with responsibility for each of those areas, including HR.  His "combined" salary jumped from about $85,000 to $107,500, with far less responsibilities. Each district will have a half-time Business Manager (21/2 days per weeks).  Didn't really save anything on that set-up.  Maybe 1/2 of $85,000 would have saved some money for .5 employee.   chmoore

It has to start at the top. The superintendent has to be held accountable for getting rid of people who don't perform. I have seen him get rid of people who do their jobs very well. Those who are failures, are not held accountable.

I thought she was going to say that they need to pass a levy to pay for the mandate.

chmoore1,

Chmoore1,