A Better Middletown
Printed From: MiddletownUSA.com
Category: Middletown Community
Forum Name: Middletown News, Info and Happenings
Forum Description: Discuss any Middletown Ohio area news story.
URL: http://www.middletownusa.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=4640
Printed Date: May 18 2024 at 3:41am
Topic: A Better Middletown
Posted By: Mike_Presta
Subject: A Better Middletown
Date Posted: Jun 30 2012 at 6:36pm
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I tried to post the following in the new "A Better Middletown" category, but I did not "have permission" to do so  :I’ll be the first to post in this new MiddletownUSA category by opining that the most important issue we must solve to lead to “A Better Middletown” is that of crime in our city. I had occasion to spend the best part of last Friday as an observer in the Middletown Municipal Court room. I was appalled and alarmed to see the amazing number of repeat offenders and their apparent disregard for the law. Especially dismaying was the large number of female offenders. In my opinion, we can bring all of the arts, fine dining, and community colleges to town and do all the clearing of blight, and property code enforcement that even the most ardent supporters of these activities can imagine in their wildest dreams, and Middletown’s future will not become one bit brighter unless we take prompt and meaningful actions to address the substantial crime problems in our city. Since we have over a million dollars in our General Fund which is now available to be “reallocated”, I believe that our city and its citizenry will be better served if it is immediately reallocated towards fighting this problem. ------------- “Mulligan said he ... doesn’t believe they necessarily make the return on investment necessary to keep funding them.” …The Middletown Journal, January 30, 2012 |
Replies:
Posted By: Mike_Presta
Date Posted: Jun 30 2012 at 6:44pm
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I am unsure as to the answer to the above problem, but
perhaps a good first step might be a “Sheriff Joe Arpaio-type” expansion of our city jail. Perhaps we need to make it clearly known to
all criminal types that Middletown is NOT the place where they want to conduct
their activities because they will be very, very sorry of the result when they
get caught. ------------- “Mulligan said he ... doesn’t believe they necessarily make the return on investment necessary to keep funding them.” …The Middletown Journal, January 30, 2012 |
Posted By: Bocephus
Date Posted: Jun 30 2012 at 11:31pm
Its a joke how easy repeat offenders get off it offers no incintive to not commit crimes.Why do they even bother arresting them hell that would solve the cities financial issues just lay off all the cops errr never mind we need them to harras law abiding citizens that go a few miles over the speed limit 
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Posted By: Mike_Presta
Date Posted: Jul 01 2012 at 12:45am
That is why I mentioned expanding the size (and the harshness) of the jail. From what I could see and hear last Friday, the convicted offenders were getting fined heavily and sentenced to jail terms. However, they had no assets to pay the fines, and there was not enough room in the jail to hold them all, so they were credited with "time served" and the remainder of the sentence had to be suspended. I don't believe that we have room to hold everyone that really belongs in jail. I think that the judges' hands are tied due to lack of jail space. The unallocated $1.1 million could make a start towards locking some of these repeat offenders up. If they get locked up every time, for a longer period each time, perhaps they will move away (taking their Section 8 vouchers, if they have them, with them) and practice their criminal activities somewhere that they won't face such harsh penalties. Then Middletown WILL begin to have a "brighter future"!!!
------------- “Mulligan said he ... doesn’t believe they necessarily make the return on investment necessary to keep funding them.” …The Middletown Journal, January 30, 2012 |
Bocephus wrote:Posted By: spiderjohn
Date Posted: Jul 01 2012 at 8:31am
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amen Mr.P and Bocephus try doing business in my current location the changing of my neighborhood has been overwhelming Crime from the rail tracks east to Supthin is skyrocketing, and heading right in to the Highlands(gasp!) like a Tsunami. Good business owners can deal with competition, however they are up against it vs. a never-ending spiraling wave of criminal activity and poverty. Which leads to a wonderful 1yo organization called Middletown Business Watch(started by my wife!) LARGE(and growing) group of local business owners banding together WITH the police dept.and local Chamber of Commerce. No acknowledgement or recognition from Council or Admin though(hmmmmm?) Only visits from candidates RUNNING for Council, who never re-appear(or give us a mention) after the election. Ya might want to watch this week's Council meeting for a brief introduction/presentation/message. We NEED community support(NO--we don't want yer $$!)
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Posted By: VietVet
Date Posted: Jul 01 2012 at 8:56am
That's right Mike. Stick the little problem kids (male-female alike) out under a tent in a fenced-in area of town in this 100 degree weather with one bottle of water to last all day to do their time. Give 'em one Porta-Potty to use. Let 'em learn rationing. No more jail with air conditioning for their pampered carcass. Make them serve every day, hour and minute of the sentence handed down by the judge. Let 'em sweat a little and feel some discomfort. Take 'em out in the heat to pick up trash around the city., and if they complain, tack on an extra day or two per complaint so that they learn to keep their mouth shut and learn the rules. Make it as unpleasant as you can. Maybe some, not all, as some are too ignorant to learn, won't return. Like the schools, the current method offers no effective deterrent to stop the behavior. It is a joke. JMO |
Posted By: Vivian Moon
Date Posted: Jul 01 2012 at 9:37am
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Mr. Presta I have the answer to your problem. In fact my answer solves several problems at the same time. |
Posted By: acclaro
Date Posted: Jul 01 2012 at 10:38am
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No, you are all wrong. Recall Judge Wall stated all it took was Cincinnati State coming, and instead of crime, criminals would be pursuing education. There is some truth to that, and perhaps with the money being raised to entice students, and jail time, that's a solution. Instead of six months in jail, you have an option of taking two semesters at Cincinnati State. I disagree about the jail. Middletown should close its court and jail, but that is the only source for feeding the few remaining attorneys in Middletown, and the public funding they get from the county and state. The question is, what is driving crime, the inability to find work in Middletown? Well, throwing them in jail doesn't solve the problem. It perpetuates a circuitous circle of jain in, jail out, jail in...et al. Putting $$$ in the jail is a bad idea. Use the money (or a portion thereof), to invest in education for those in crime (low offenders) to get an Associates Degree and then work. Self esteem and a job solves problems, expansion of a jail does nothing. ------------- 'An appeaser is one who feeds a crocodile, hoping it will eat him last.' - Winston Churchill |
Posted By: John Beagle
Date Posted: Jul 01 2012 at 1:52pm
Interesting thought. ------------- http://www.johnbeagle.com/" rel="nofollow - John Beagle Middletown USA News of, for and by the people of Middletown, Ohio. |
Posted By: VietVet
Date Posted: Jul 01 2012 at 1:59pm
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acclaro:
"Recall Judge Wall stated all it took was Cincinnati State coming, and instead of crime, criminals would be pursuing education" I doubt it. A rather naive statement to make by Walls. Criminals don't pursue educational opportunities. Criminals pursue "breaking the law" activities. A result of their background and upbringing. It is what they know. They have never been shown that there are more ways to make money than to steal it. Never shown that an education might improve their lives. No role model to follow toward education....just crime. A dad, older brother, mother, best friend to watch growing up....and follow in their footsteps. acclaro: "Putting $$$ in the jail is a bad idea. Use the money (or a portion thereof), to invest in education for those in crime (low offenders) to get an Associates Degree and then work. Self esteem and a job solves problems, expansion of a jail does nothing" With all due respect acclaro, trying to instill self esteem into a person who chooses to steal copper from a construction site to buy their drugs, instilling self esteem in a person who robs or commits armed robbery in a convenience store or instilling self esteem in a person who uses or sells drugs is a bit of a stretch. Offering them classes at CS? Doubt if they have the mindset to take the offer. Not the type to sit in a class and learn the subject matter taught, coming from the background that has lead them to the criminal element in society. Three ways to go to deal with them. The current "no-deterrent" method where they laugh at the system, only to repeat offenses. Do as you suggest and offer them a shot at a better life through education, which most, I believe would not take advantage of, or do as I suggest.....make life so hard on them when they are convicted, that they wish they never chose the criminal life they did. acclaro: "The question is, what is driving crime, the inability to find work in Middletown?" I would imagine a certain percentage of the crime would be here even if the town was booming. I would guess that the city leaders accepting any and all Section 8 candidates has something to do with it. I would also guess that a percentage of crime could be attributed to people from Dayton, Cincinnati and outside the city coming to town and committing crime. According to the Journal and the police, crime is increased by the presence of gangs in Middletown that are now being cleared out. The fact that Middletown has become the SW Ohio ghetto capital and the invited poverty that has become the norm here, contributes also. Finally, your suggestion of a lack of work for the people certainly has a bearing on growing crime as people become more desperate. All we have to do is put people back to work, eliminate the drawing card for the outside criminal element to come to town and close the door on Section 8, stopping the practice of putting out the welcome mat for low income to make a dent in the crime. Impossible to do with the current mindset of the city leaders. Cleaning council/city building houses and replacing with the right people would start us in the right direction. Also impossible to do with the current mindset of the apathetic citizens. |
Posted By: rngrmed
Date Posted: Jul 01 2012 at 5:03pm
| I work as a search consultant. If you have a criminal record, good luck finding a job. Even with a Baccalaureate degree or higher. |
Posted By: Mike_Presta
Date Posted: Jul 01 2012 at 6:03pm
From what I could see and hear (How can I put this sensitively?) for many of these characters, I doubt that finding a job is a high priority. Many seem to prefer a life of surviving on a variety of government programs supplemented by the profits from their criminal activities.
------------- “Mulligan said he ... doesn’t believe they necessarily make the return on investment necessary to keep funding them.” …The Middletown Journal, January 30, 2012 |
Posted By: rngrmed
Date Posted: Jul 01 2012 at 6:24pm
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I know what you mean. And I know the type without being there. I just get frustrated when people preach that education will fix the issue. Well, maybe education would have fixed the issue prior to them becoming life long offenders. It may not be daily, but pretty close, that I talk to a candidate that has no shot of a career change or finding anything because of his criminal record. And most are educated.
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Posted By: Neil Barille
Date Posted: Jul 01 2012 at 8:09pm
| I tend to disagree with acclaro and the Judge on this one. Maybe they are correct if we're looking long term but not immediately. For immediate impact I do think a large jail and a reputatiion for maximum sentences would clean up some trashy characters off the street when they do offend and might scare off some others. |
Posted By: spiderjohn
Date Posted: Jul 01 2012 at 8:32pm
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maybe quite a few here need to spend a month or so down in the court room to see what is really going on there It is incredible and frightening Then again--maybe y'all are better off not knowing As mentioned--education is not in the mind set of most offenders, and you really can't educate someone who doesn't want to be educated. Last time I was there for an issue, it was the person's 72nd time in the court room his pd pleaded that his client was ready to change his life maybe he needs education! Cincy State?
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Posted By: Mike_Presta
Date Posted: Jul 01 2012 at 10:24pm
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Spiderjohn: I agree. On Friday, one person was there for the 43rd time...probably more times than he would attend any class. The judge did reccommend community college as a way out for a couple of the first-timers as a better option than continuing their life of crime, but he seemed resigned to the fact that such a suggestion would be falling on deaf ears for most. (Or, perhaps he had already suggested additional education to most of them a few dozen times each already???)
------------- “Mulligan said he ... doesn’t believe they necessarily make the return on investment necessary to keep funding them.” …The Middletown Journal, January 30, 2012 |
Posted By: Mike_Presta
Date Posted: Jul 01 2012 at 10:42pm
One note of caution though, if anyone is thinking about visiting the court for a day: Don't take your wife if you aren't willing to teach her (or have her taught) to handle firearms. I'm going to look into a course for both my wife and my daughter. ------------- “Mulligan said he ... doesn’t believe they necessarily make the return on investment necessary to keep funding them.” …The Middletown Journal, January 30, 2012 |
Posted By: bumper
Date Posted: Jul 02 2012 at 9:01am
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Mike this would be a good thing to take firearm courses in self defence.. do alot of target shooting with the ladies so they feel confident in useing a handgun safely, the ccw course i took with real good Instructors.. look at this web page they are in morrow. you can split a 12 hr. class on sundays with them..this is their web site littlemiamitactical.com you might want to start out small with a 22 cal then once the ladies get used to the smaller guns then go for the real knock down power you need in self defence,the mid size 40 cal or the mid size 45 cal . IMO GLOCK has the best!!!
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Posted By: spiderjohn
Date Posted: Jul 04 2012 at 7:43am
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middletown business watch: made a nice presentation last night during citizen comments disappointing that only Joe Mullifgan gave them any recognition the rest of the Council session was the usual begging, pleading, whining chaos that we now expect and get every two weeks. More talks of mysterious money-shuffling and pandering to the former downtown area's special interests and "entitled "wanters" instead of those who honestly "need" crime efforts take a back seat to fake expensive ornamental sidewalk lights fine if ya want 'em--just install/pay for them yerself and leave the rest of us out of it. pretty nice to get a small section of your street paved for free, city subsidized sidewalk light addition with the rest of town picking up the monthly tab for operating these lights. Can my street be next?
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Posted By: ground swat
Date Posted: Jul 04 2012 at 8:20am
| Why citizens comments? This town can't even run a meeting. This was a presentation correct? As stated before Middletowns motto: " Lets do it we'll figure out the cost later". How much have we spent on the research for these lights? They wanted their "Island" so do the research pay for it yourself. Rome is burning. Spider this council is without a doubt a mixed up group. Regardless of how you feel about the ward system ending, the less we have behind that table the better. Thanks Picard for bringing us all back to our senses for how bright our future is. Downtown I guess is the end of the rainbow? Bravo to Mrs. Dillman for standing up and forcing the issue about the crime problem in this town. Shame on this City Manager for not attending these meetings even when we have AG folks down from the state. Truth hurts what piss poor leadership. On another note lets remember those without power today, going to be a hot one again. |
Posted By: spiderjohn
Date Posted: Jul 04 2012 at 12:49pm
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what we have become featuring the classic line: "He can't find a job, but he's found a gun." |
Posted By: squeemy
Date Posted: Jul 05 2012 at 12:00pm
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One video deserves another. I've been reading John Gatto for many years and agree with his assessment of American schooling. Really more of a podcast than video but if you can endure his delivery, you'll be in for a rude awakening. "Death by Pedagogy: A Teacher's Polemic Against Institutional Learning"https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h4fKbbv_b9o& |
Posted By: randy
Date Posted: Jul 05 2012 at 3:43pm
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Reading some of the comments on this subject caused me to do a little research. The Middletown City jail holds 80 inmates, in a city of 48K that’s not a lot of jail space. That alone makes it really hard to keep people in jail for the minor crimes. For most major crimes the inmates are sent to Butler County where they can hold close to 1,000 inmates. Both jails are at capacity as of today. That means to lock someone up right now someone has to be let out. So who do you let out? I do agree that things should be much tougher on repeat offenders. But there is nowhere to put them. The fact is that Middletown’s crime rate be it petty crime or the more serious crimes are a major issue. The problem affects everyone from business owners to home owners. Is section 8 the cause of all these problems? I have no doubt that the high numbers of vouchers have a played a serious role in the crime in this town. There is a bigger picture to look at. The bigger picture is this. Number of Prisoners: 1st place is U S: 2,019,234 & 2nd place is China 1,549,000 The U S has 1200 prisons There are too many people in prison in this county. Look around at the laws that lock up people for the same things over and over again. The prison system itself is soft on the inmates. Cable TV work out rooms and sports and it is all free to them. No one that has been to prison fears going back; I remember years ago a kid (from Dayton I think) was arrested in Singapore for spray painting a car. The law for that crime was to be publically flogged. Source wikipedia: Michael Peter Fay (born May 30, 1975) is an American who briefly gained international notoriety when he was sentenced to caning in Singapore as an 18-year-old in 1994 for theft and vandalism. Caning is a routine court sentence in Singapore but most Americans were unfamiliar with it, and Fay's case was believed to be the first caning involving an American citizen.[1] The number of cane strokes in his sentence was reduced from six to four after U.S. officials requested leniency. Michael Fay duly received four strokes of the cane across his bare buttocks on May 5, 1994 at Queenstown Remand Centre. Do you think that Fay messed with another car in Singapore? Maybe it is time to stop locking them up and start bringing out the cane. ------------- Call me for a www.CameraSecurityNow.com" rel="nofollow - www.CameraSecurityNow.com quote 513-422-1907 x357 |
Posted By: VietVet
Date Posted: Jul 06 2012 at 6:22am
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randy: "Both jails are at capacity as of today. That means to lock someone up right now someone has to be let out. So who do you let out?"
You don't let anyone out. You find a contained area with high fences. Construct some open air tents and set a couple of Porta-Pots out there and let them enjoy the outdoors, be it heat or cold. Of course, then, you'll have to contend with the bleeding heart/kinder-gentler/prisoners have rights ACLU who are part of the problem with the promotion of relaxing discipline in society. It is a free-for-all now. Dam near do anything you want nowadays and receive a painful "slap on the wrist" from these weak judges. The criminal element isn't intimidated anymore by the police, the judges nor the court system. Every time they are given a lecture, let off with a fine or handed a suspended sentence, it re-enforces their lack of respect for the law. JMO randy: "Maybe it is time to stop locking them up and start bringing out the cane" Bingo! But will never happen. (when does the right thing happen anymore in today's society?) Look at how much the politicians (and criminals- same thing) are getting away with now....at all levels. Look at the schools and the lack of any respect for authority given by the kids. ( if we just show little Johnny some kindness, he'll straighten up and fly right....as little Johnny laughs at them (and plays them like a cheap violin) Look at the defiant looks on the faces of the criminals....it has become a game to them and the game had it's fear factor taken from it years ago as we became more kind and gentle, thinking we could rehabilitate most of them. It is a joke to pretend that these people will change for the better if we are nice to them. They just laugh and play the system to the hilt with appeal after appeal, release and repeat offense after release......Just wondering what is going through a cops mind when they arrest someone for the 15th time, just to see them back out on the street again in 24 hours. The rules in society have gone down the toilet because we actually pay attention to the ACLU and the other "be kind-criminals have rights" crap. Why? JMO again. |
Posted By: arwendt
Date Posted: Jul 06 2012 at 9:03am
Agree! When I wake up every morning and read stories along the lines of some idiot smashing through a glass door with his bare hands to steal half a dozen bags of chips from a Subway.. there is clearly no real concern for the consequences of one's actions. We have grown soft, we have grown complacent, and we have become brainwashed with the idea that pleasantries, instead of punishment, can solve our crime problem. ------------- “Sell not virtue to purchase wealth, nor Liberty to purchase power.” Benjamin Franklin - More at my http://wordsoffreedom.wordpress.com/ - Words of Freedom website. |
Posted By: rngrmed
Date Posted: Jul 06 2012 at 9:37am
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I didn't see the article about someone smashing through the window at Subway to get chips. But my guess is that if someone is doing this, they have bigger concerns. Then again, I'm sure that is just a small excerpt from the article. Maybe it was just someone being a malicious. And I'm not excusing the crime, based on the individual's rationale. They are still wrong. Just because you break a law, doesn't deem you a hardened criminal.
How many people in here complain about the camera lights. Why? If you don't run the red lights, it is not an issue. Maybe the repeat offenders need some jail time. What about those that smoke "a little" dope? Not hurting anyone, but still against the law. And no, I don't smoke, or pop pills, hell I haven't even had a drink of alcohol in over 2 years. What if the Subway guy is able to pay restitution? |
Posted By: VietVet
Date Posted: Jul 06 2012 at 10:46am
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rngrmed: "How many people in here complain about the camera lights. Why?"
Won't speak for anyone else on this forum, but for me, it is all about Big Brother Government (city,state,feds- doesn't matter) watching over my shoulder and attempting to oversee my behavior. I don't need an entity as inept as the lousy government dictating to me how I should act in my own car. Same way with telling me I must wear a seatbelt in my car. We've all heard of the driver and passengers dying from not wearing their seatbelts, right? Ever hear of a person in the other car dying because the opposing car's occupants weren't wearing belts? It is none of the governments business to try and tell me how safe I choose to be INSIDE my car. If it affects those OUTSIDE the car....different story. The cameras? IMO only, too much gov. intrusion and let's face it, the cops and the city can give you all the crapola they want about their concern for our safety but that's, at best, secondary. It is strictly a revenue enhancement program done, in Middletown's case, because the city leaders are too ignorant and lazy to gain meaningful revenue the correct way through payroll and corporate taxes. Would require too much effort on their part to make that happen. Easier to beat the hell out of the people for money. Furthermore, I haven't heard where the cameras have made much of a difference in accident reductions as people will speed through the yellow light to avoid the ticket on the red, intimidated by the cameras themselves. JMO |
Posted By: rngrmed
Date Posted: Jul 06 2012 at 1:14pm
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Vet- My point is if people were obeying the traffic laws in the first place, the cameras wouldn't make a bit of a difference.
As far as seat belts, Yes I have heard of people in opposing cars being injured. But that is/was where I earned my living, taking care of injured/hurt people. You can even say being forced to wear a safety belt is related to money. If you were to become injured in a car accident because you were not wearing your seat belt or not wearing it properly you may not be able to work or end up in a long term care facility. Oh yeah, most insurance policies do not pay if you are injured or killed and found to be not wearing your seat belt. Do you want to be the individual that caused a car accident and killed someone because they chose not to wear their seat belt. People think all this crime is something new, its not. I remember there was a time in this Country when horse thieves were hung in the public. People continued to steal horses. I'm glad there are seat belt requirements, but at the same time I think that it is a double standard because of other lifestyle choices that cause health related issues. One way or the other we end up paying because of the choices someone else makes. |
Posted By: TonyB
Date Posted: Jul 06 2012 at 2:47pm
| When are you "privatize government" people going to get it through your head that they WANT more people in jail!!! This country is now going back to putting people in prison for debt!!! Why? Because when you can make money putting people in prison, the government will come up with all sorts of creative laws that make those who support their candidacy money! Notice when politicians and the rich go to jail, they get the "minimum security" country club detainment? It's only the poor who get to go to "private prisons" where they can be forced to work for pennies and denied basic human rights. I'm all for the idea "if you do the crime, you do the time", it's just that I can't see someone else being allowed to profit from it! |
Posted By: arwendt
Date Posted: Jul 06 2012 at 3:45pm
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Not a fan of privatizing detention facilities. ------------- “Sell not virtue to purchase wealth, nor Liberty to purchase power.” Benjamin Franklin - More at my http://wordsoffreedom.wordpress.com/ - Words of Freedom website. |
Posted By: randy
Date Posted: Jul 06 2012 at 4:33pm
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Great Show! Source CNBC.com Try to catch the replays at night. Worth the watch. CNBC's Billions Behind Bars: Inside America’s Prison Industry “Billions Behind Bars: Inside America’s Prison Industry,” a CNBC original documentary, goes behind the razor wires to investigate the profits and inner-workings of the multi-billion dollar corrections industry. With more than 2.3 million people locked up, the U.S. has the highest incarceration rate in the world. One out of 100 American adults is behind bars – while a stunning one out of 32 is on probation, parole or in prison. This reliance on mass incarceration has created a thriving prison economy. The states and the federal government together spend roughly $74 billion a year on corrections, and nearly 800,000 people work in the industry. From some of the poorest towns in America to some of the wealthiest investment firms on Wall Street, CNBC’s http://www.cnbc.com/id/15838202/ - |
Posted By: VietVet
Date Posted: Jul 07 2012 at 9:34am
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"Vet- My point is if people were obeying the traffic laws in the first place, the cameras wouldn't make a bit of a difference."
Agree rngmed. I still maintain that I don't need nor want government monitoring my private life to the degree that they choose to put up cameras and take pictures....especially (IMO) for revenue. They really could care less about my safety nor welfare. Their weak attempt, hiding their revenue intentions under the guise of safety, is a joke. Gotta remember, I came from the generation that mistrusted all government. Some in my generation have become what we use to hate. I have not lost the feeling of despising authority I don't respect. That includes politicians, city building residents, some managers in private industry over 44 years and those that come up with laws that invade my privacy (like how safe I should be in my own car) rngmed: "As far as seat belts, Yes I have heard of people in opposing cars being injured" We differ here. I've been driving for 47 years and have NEVER heard of a situation where the person NOT WEARING the seatbelt, ran into another car and caused injury to the passengers of the other car ATTRIBUTED TO NOT WEARING SAID SEATBELT. Injury to the person not wearing the seatbelt- certainly. Don't see how that could possibly happen without the person without the seatbelt being ejected through the windshield and directly into the windshield of the oncoming car. Dam near impossible. rngmed: "Do you want to be the individual that caused a car accident and killed someone because they chose not to wear their seat belt" Of course not. I will agree with your statement until it reaches "because they chose not to wear their seat belt". I am responsible for causing the accident and for the injuries incurred by the occupants of the other car to a point. I am NOT responsible for them deciding not to wear their seatbelt and the injuries attributed to their decision. rngmed: "I'm glad there are seat belt requirements", We disagree here too. I am not. It is another government intrusion into the lives of private citizens. Remember when the authorities "suggested" we wear the seat belts? Then they said they will "monitor" us wearing them. Then, they said if you are stopped for another violation and found not wearing a seat belt, they would add that to the charge. Then, they escalated it to "we can charge you with not wearing the seat belt even if you are not in violation of any other infraction". It is bull---- the way they ramped this up to dictate to the public how safe they should be inside their private car. This, IMO, is a mild form for fascism. |